Arsenal of Democracy

[stroguy]

Live feed from DC

http://ww2flyover.org

[Limoles]

... and Peace has been achieved . NO WARS !!!!!!!! Ever !!!

http://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/victory-in-europe

[stroguy]

You just keep hoping.....history is stacked way against you.

[Limoles]

My promotion of hope :

1) to cherish a desire with anticipation ,

2) to desire with expectation of obtainment ,

3) and expect the best with confidence .

[53driver]

All of Europe in the mid-30s thought the same thing Les.
Because there was a mightier force to combat the threat, the map of Europe doesn't say "Germany" the from Atlantic to the Black Sea.

History is doomed to repeat itself....again.

[Limoles]

All of Europe in the mid-30s thought the same thing Les.
Because there was a mightier force to combat the threat, the map of Europe doesn't say "Germany" the from Atlantic to the Black Sea.

History is doomed to repeat itself....again.

No - HISTORY is the BEST TEACHER , if one wants to learn ...

[53driver]

No - HISTORY is the BEST TEACHER , if one wants to learn ...

Aye....ready, set, go!

[stroguy]

My best teacher was Miss Thompson in HomeEc. As I said history is against you. Keep on hoping and I'll keep watch.

[Limoles]

My best teacher was Miss Thompson in HomeEc. As I said history is against you. Keep on hoping and I'll keep watch.

Accepted , if this only can secure my destiny .

[53driver]

Accepted , if this only can secure my destiny .

Why rely on someone else for your destiny?

[Bill1584]

My promotion of hope :

1) to cherish a desire with anticipation ,

2) to desire with expectation of obtainment ,

3) and expect the best with confidence .

4) and carry a big stick.

[shooter]

My best teacher was Miss Thompson in HomeEc. As I said history is against you. Keep on hoping and I'll keep watch.

So tell us about this Miss Thompson Stro.

[srt8-in-largo]

Wish I coulda been there to see this.

[srt8-in-largo]

As a side note... why do so many insist on calling ourselves a democracy? We are not; we're a republic.

[BIGLRY]

As a side note... why do so many insist on calling ourselves a democracy? We are not; we're a republic.
Hummmmm...

Republic(noun): a state in which the supreme power rests in the body of citizens entitled to vote and is exercised by representatives chosen directly or indirectly by them. any body of persons viewed as a commonwealth. a state in which the head of government is not a monarch or other hereditary head of state.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/republic

Democracy(noun): government by the people; a form of government in which the supreme power is vested in the people and exercised directly by them or by their elected agents under a free electoral system. a state having such a form of government: The United States and Canada are democracies.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/democracy

I guess the key words are "State" verses "Government", the Republic of California is in the Democracy of the United States....correct? :shrug:

[53driver]

Other delta: we don't have a "free electoral system" - we have an electoral college.

[stroguy]

Using democracy is just a simple reference to a philosophical set of governance.

[Limoles]

How would you call the System , which in "Democracy Principals" support Monarchies and in the same time militarily overthrowing democratically elected leaders of another countries ? I just want to clarify the meaning of Hypocrisy .

[jm21ddd15]

" I pledge alegience to the flag of The United States of America. And to the Republic for witch it stands". That should end the question of A Democracy or a Republic. Either way you describe our Country, It is the BEST on the Planet! If someone disagrees, then they can go somewhere else to live. I'm proud to be an American. We don't always do the correct things, but no other place does either.

[srt8-in-largo]

I understand the colloquial usage... but it's inaccurate. I wouldn't call a chicken a turkey and I don't refer to my bathtub as a tea kettle.

I also don't get how it seems to be a "Patriotic" fad to tell people who disagree to move out; this can be argued to be just the opposite... un-Patriotic... un-American... un-Free Thinking... and simplistic. If I wanted to live in a country where we were all FORCED to think in lock-step with each other, well, I guess there are countries that favor that.

We as a PEOPLE are great... and we as a GOVERNMENT are also pretty darn good. But as a GOVERNMENT, we've also done some conniving under-handed, and, yes, hypocritical things. Shall we put on the rose-colored glasses and look upon these things with smiles? Or shall we recognize such actions for what they are and strive to be better?

We show no integrity if we can't recognize our own faults; the greatest honor that can be bestowed upon the guys who died in WWII is to hold ourselves to high standards and continue being a place worth defending.

[Limoles]

5 ) I'm still thinking about "building # 7" , when nobody was able to put "the big stick" to support its structure ... and another as well . Where were you and what did you do ... to prevent ( not so mysterious ) collapse ?

[53driver]

5 ) I'm still thinking about "building # 7" , when nobody was able to put "the big stick" to support its structure ... and another as well . Where were you and what did you do ... to prevent ( not so mysterious ) collapse ?

Les - you lost me here.....I'm not understanding the reference to "building #7."

[stroguy]

It's a reference to government inside work on 9/11. Some folks have vivid imaginations.

[53driver]

It's a reference to government inside work on 9/11. Some folks have vivid imaginations.Copy. Thank you.


5 ) I'm still thinking about "building # 7" , when nobody was able to put "the big stick" to support its structure ... and another as well . Where were you and what did you do ... to prevent ( not so mysterious ) collapse ?

Context Les - let's get it right: the "big stick" is a deterrent, not a construction component to support that which has been damaged. If our politicians were doing their job, nothing would have been damaged in the first place.

And to answer your question: on 9/11, I was the executive officer of a Wing Support Squadron and we immediately began preparations for deployment to carry a "big stick" into al quaeda's backyard.

[Limoles]

Les - you lost me here.....I'm not understanding the reference to "building #7."

Do you remember the day of 09/11/2011 ?
I did and it was the day , when I recognized all aspects of magnified FEAR and ANGER .
Then , we began to think , asking : WHY IT HAPPENED ? Did we deserve it , or not ?
Nobody should die in such a circumstances , but it also proved , that theory of
"waiving big stick to scare others" happened to be not so smart . Those , who love
the history and understand human nature , can stimulate their analysis even farther .

Beside , I'm still thinking , why "building # 7" collapsed and who was behind it ?
Most knows the answer , because was confirmed with engineers and scientists already.

Again - I still believe in power of "extended hand" much more , than any aggression against each other .
All those cocky , or cowboys style attitudes should diminish long time ago and doing so , it could attract
more friends and followers around the world . We are not alone and we are not entitled to poses all natural resources . They belong to others and these people are NOT worse than you or me . They have families too .

Beside , my question still remain valid : "Who start the fire" ?
Is there any of you , who make attempts to extinguish that fire ?



"An eye for an eye only ends up making the whole world blind".
Mahatma Gandhi

[53driver]

Do you remember the day of 09/11/2011 ?
I did and it was the day , when I recognized all aspects of magnified FEAR and ANGER .
Then , we began to think , asking : WHY IT HAPPENED ? Did we deserve it , or not ?
...
Again - I still believe in power of "extended hand" much more , than any aggression against each other .
All those cocky , or cowboys style attitudes should diminish long time ago and doing so , it could attract
more friends and followers around the world . We are not alone and we are not entitled to poses all natural resources . They belong to others and these people are NOT worse than you or me . They have families too .

Beside , my question still remain valid : "Who start the fire" ?
Is there any of you , who make attempts to extinguish that fire ?



"An eye for an eye only ends up making the whole world blind".
Mahatma Gandhi

To answer your question:
"Who started the fire?" is determined by at what point in history you say "go."

Les - so what is your "foreign policy"? Let's say Obama just made you Secretary of State.
How are you going to implement all your hypotheses?

[Limoles]

To answer your question:
"Who started the fire?" is determined by at what point in history you say "go."

Les - so what is your "foreign policy"? Let's say Obama just made you Secretary of State.
How are you going to implement all your hypotheses?

1 ) Brits , whose Imperial thievery appetite became the norm . Needed OIL made American Corporations wearing their boots so well.

2 ) Obama was a good , intelligent businessman , so I could invite him for a dinner to make a deal . That move could prevent growing terrorism , which you don't know , how to deal with anymore. And I wouldn't sent young boys for suicidal war , which didn't benefit my country at all . Did you know , that OBL was on CIA payroll anyway ? This is also a history .

3 ) To best of my knowledge I will answer to all your questions . Please continue ....

[jm21ddd15]

To my knowledge, the U.S. has a voluntary Army. Nobody got "sent" that wasn't aware of what they were doing. Myself and my son are both Military vets who "volunteered" and don't regret it, unlike some in the White House that never enlisted.

[53driver]

To my knowledge, the U.S. has a voluntary Army. Nobody got "sent" that wasn't aware of what they were doing. Myself and my son are both Military vets who "volunteered" and don't regret it, unlike some in the White House that never enlisted.

Thank you and your son for your service.

[53driver]

1 ) Brits , whose Imperial thievery appetite became the norm . Needed OIL made American Corporations wearing their boots so well.

2 ) Obama was a good , intelligent businessman , so I could invite him for a dinner to make a deal . That move could prevent growing terrorism , which you don't know , how to deal with anymore. And I wouldn't sent young boys for suicidal war , which didn't benefit my country at all . Did you know , that OBL was on CIA payroll anyway ? This is also a history .

3 ) To best of my knowledge I will answer to all your questions . Please continue ....

Les:
Please be more specific.
What year are you calling "when the world was right and then wrongs started happening?"

Okay, your plan starts with abdicating our alliances for protection using US manpower and money. Is that correct? No no more global police force.
After that I'm not sure where you are going. Please elaborate.

Also, inviting a "community organizer" (Obama is NOT not an intelligent businessman - no empirical evidence) to dinner is not a foreign policy...please do better than that.
And yes, OBL's movement in so far as it supported the war against Russia was financed by CIA - in spite of LtCol North's warnings in the early 80s.

[stroguy]

obama, a intelligent businessman? OK. Stand on a pedestal and make a choice. Pat Tillman did. Politicians make horrible soldiers because they don't understand the concept of war.....kill and destroy. The Neville Chamberlains and FDR's never get it until the knife is at their throats. Then the only resolution is war. You want to sit down with people that smile during tea while their friends are in the backroom slitting your child's throat? Go right ahead. The statement of 'who started the fire' confirms plenty to me. To me there is no way to justify WHO started the fire. You take a side and the hand of the Pat Tillman's and you defend what you perceive as righteous and true. I don't let the diarrhea of the interweb and quacks confuse me. I know what America is, stands for and will always be. You don't.

Plenty of scientists and engineers have also come up with 5 different theories on how and why JFK was killed. Having a degree and a college education does not give you a pass to the truth. I know plenty of just plain dumb folks with college degrees. Since you like to always refer people to go read, how about you go read the educated ramblings of a sheila jackson lee. You will need no further proof of my claim.

[shooter]

OK , so I'm tired of people calling Obama 'intelligent'. This so called 'great orator' has never been proven. If you watch him you will see that this man may have at the best average intelligence. Unimpressive to say the least. I'm just giving my opinion and observations. If that offends anyone , tough.

[Limoles]

Sorry . Not paying attention to the spelling , I made mistake , looking over not so clear sentence , related to "shooter's" hypothetical question . Instead Obama ( in that time he was unknown anyway ) , that mentioned name suppose to be OSAMA , which is completely changing the logic of my response :

"Osama was a good , intelligent businessman , so I could invite him for a dinner to make a deal . That move could prevent growing terrorism , which you don't know now , how to deal with anymore."

In fact , Bush and his administration , prior to that tragic event knew , who he was and what OBL capabilities were , especially the White House was aware of possible attack , but for some unknown reason lost "strategic cleverness". There were many occasions to capture him , or assassinate . You tell me , why it didn't happened ? Yes , using my diplomacy , I would invite him for the dinner and offer my conditions of the deal , means - get the oil ( and pay for it ) , but in exchange , to withdraw American Forces from Saudi Arabian fields . Wouldn't be it fair ? That's how I ( and rest of the world ) see it and how fair business should be conducted among ( long time ) partners . Wouldn't it prevent America from living in fear now ? The same conditions of the deal were presented by Osama much earlier , but it was ignored and consequently his masterminded RETALIATION responded in unprecedented scale . The fundamental cores of Arab's mentality and muslim's faith are exclusions of foreign troops in THEIR LAND . I think , the same policies apply to any independent country , incl. USA . Isn't it ultimate right of individual state's sovereignty ?

Then "shooter" asked for more specific.
"Okay, your plan starts with abdicating our alliances for protection using US manpower and money. Is that correct? No no more global police force. After that I'm not sure where you are going. Please elaborate."

Actually you made my point . Are you trying to tell me , that BP , Chevron , Mobil and Shell are our "alliances" ?
Who gave you rights to occupy foreign territories in the name of dirty profits of few ? Don't tell me it's your job to manifest your PATRIOTISM in such a mission . Where are your moral codes , which we should respect and to be proud of ? If your Army Boys are so brave , why they don't protect slaughtered and innocent people in the rest of the world now ? In many countries bloodshed is the daily event and I don't see presence of any of our soldiers to stop , or even prevent it . Arabs , with their believes , culture , style of life and long history have their own way of existence and we don't need , or must not to change it . It's for themselves - not for us , distanced by time and ocean .
Look at the world now - wherever Americans were acting without UN and trying to "restore" , or establish the New Order , they faced failures . What they do instead ? They protect Big Businesses with military installations , where people of entire world DO NOT ACCEPT IT ! Now do you know , why "anti-American" sentiment is so strong ? Isn't that enough to understand wrongly designated motives of doing business under umbrella of "fixing" everybody's problems ? International policies are so different everywhere and are based on different principals of the people and their land . It should be recognized too . At least I do .

"jm21ddd15
To my knowledge, the U.S. has a voluntary Army. Nobody got "sent" that wasn't aware of what they were doing. Myself and my son are both Military vets who "volunteered" and don't regret it, unlike some in the White House that never enlisted.An you , send young boys to war???

Before your "voluntary" deployment , I would look at the map and check geography on focused terrain first . Did you ever recognized origin of hijackers , who were RESPONSIBLE for that attack ? If not , let me remind you :
15 of the 19 were citizens of Saudi Arabia ! The 2 others were from the United Arab Emirates , one from Egypt and one from Lebanon. So , you landed in wrong Airport ... voluntarily (?) . I can't not comment such a explanation . Or , maybe unknowingly you were dispatched to protect mines of much needed now LITHIUM ? Why under your and son's presence , production of opium has been increased and flawlessly enriched American market ? Is it OK , because of American demand for heroin , or what ? What did you do , when Taliban destroyed so many of your installations and transports of American weaponry ? Finally , what's the result of your "mission" ? Another un-complished one ? It doesn't sound right .

"stroguy"
You see - we have different opinions and backgrounds , but I do not tirade you in such a passion , which you unleash so often . You already presented your bully character and that still didn't impressed me . I detected , you are first class racist , hiding behind your American "values" , and someone else around are not worth your privileged status ( of what ? ) . It is also proving , how small you are . If you trying to convince me , that your "truth" is more valuable , so be it . It would be senseless to argue . You must live with your "adopted knowledge" and stay with your affiliated "plain dumb folks with college degrees" , which will make you feel better and maybe respected (?). For me your comment don't means much , so if will not irritate my integrity , I will always try to skip it .

[srt8-in-largo]

Obama is neither intelligent, nor a businessman, much less an intelligent businessman. I'd be doing well to call him a good speaker and leave it at that.

Building #7 was brought down by the heat of the twin towers, no? If Bush did it I'd certainly like to know :crackup:

America sure does carry a big stick... and we used the ultimate big stick to saves the worlds ass in WWII. Further, we did so with great anguish as a last resort and we subsequently did something no other country in the world would even CONSIDER; we befriended our "enemies" and rebuilt their countries.

Since the days of WWII, IMO, our government has been a bit "over-active". Of course this is an easy charge to levy; I mean who can say the world would be better had we not been so? Maybe it would be a lot worse instead. If the question is "do some segments of the world hate America due to our government" then the answer is obviously yes... but... so what. To even consider that America is itself the problem behind 911 and our current "disagreement" with the Islamacists, is weak, for lack of a better word.

For all my bitching about an "over-active" government, the fact is that many of these acts allow us to sleep soundly at night. So before I or any of us get too deep into criticizing, I would first say thank you, and further, maintain that thankfulness as we strive to keep this country as a place worth defending.

[srt8-in-largo]

Whoa...

:shock:

Les, you're reading way more into some posts than is actually there.

[srt8-in-largo]

Les, your views make a lot of assumptions and are quite conspiratory, with the USA always cast as the bad guy. The whole bit about everything being about oil is a favorite old line of the nutjobs; if America wanted the oil so bad, we'd just take it. But is that what we do? (no)

How about seeing the positives and giving the benefit of the doubt to this country... the one you chose to come to? It's impolite to take a shit in the house of your hosts. :icon_biggrin:

[Limoles]

It was Roosevelt's call in time of WAR :

"The Arsenal of Democracy" was a propaganda slogan coined by U.S. President Franklin D. Roosevelt, in a radio broadcast delivered on December 29, 1940. Roosevelt promised to help the United Kingdom fight Nazi Germany by giving them military supplies while the United States stayed out of the actual fighting. The announcement was made a year before the Attack on Pearl Harbor, at a time when Germany had occupied much of Europe and threatened Britain.
Germany was allied with Italy and Japan (the Axis powers). At the time Germany and the Soviet Union signed a non aggression treaty under the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact and had jointly invaded Poland in 1939, a deal that remained until the German invasion of the Soviet Union in 1941.
Roosevelt referred to Detroit, Michigan as "the great arsenal of democracy" because of the rapid conversion of much of the Detroit-area automotive industry to produce armaments during World War II. The speech was "a call to arm and support" the Allies in Europe, and to a lesser extent China, in their all-out war against Germany and Japan.

My call is only reminding advantages of PEACE , which I try to advocate .

ps.
So , what happened to Detroit now ?

[jm21ddd15]

Sorry . Not paying attention to the spelling , I made mistake , looking over not so clear sentence , related to "shooter's" hypothetical question . Instead Obama ( in that time he was unknown anyway ) , that mentioned name suppose to be OSAMA , which is completely changing the logic of my response :

"Osama was a good , intelligent businessman , so I could invite him for a dinner to make a deal . That move could prevent growing terrorism , which you don't know now , how to deal with anymore."

In fact , Bush and his administration , prior to that tragic event knew , who he was and what OBL capabilities were , especially the White House was aware of possible attack , but for some unknown reason lost "strategic cleverness". There were many occasions to capture him , or assassinate . You tell me , why it didn't happened ? Yes , using my diplomacy , I would invite him for the dinner and offer my conditions of the deal , means - get the oil ( and pay for it ) , but in exchange , to withdraw American Forces from Saudi Arabian fields . Wouldn't be it fair ? That's how I ( and rest of the world ) see it and how fair business should be conducted among ( long time ) partners . Wouldn't it prevent America from living in fear now ? The same conditions of the deal were presented by Osama much earlier , but it was ignored and consequently his masterminded RETALIATION responded in unprecedented scale . The fundamental cores of Arab's mentality and muslim's faith are exclusions of foreign troops in THEIR LAND . I think , the same policies apply to any independent country , incl. USA . Isn't it ultimate right of individual state's sovereignty ?

Then "shooter" asked for more specific.
"Okay, your plan starts with abdicating our alliances for protection using US manpower and money. Is that correct? No no more global police force. After that I'm not sure where you are going. Please elaborate."

Actually you made my point . Are you trying to tell me , that BP , Chevron , Mobil and Shell are our "alliances" ?
Who gave you rights to occupy foreign territories in the name of dirty profits of few ? Don't tell me it's your job to manifest your PATRIOTISM in such a mission . Where are your moral codes , which we should respect and to be proud of ? If your Army Boys are so brave , why they don't protect slaughtered and innocent people in the rest of the world now ? In many countries bloodshed is the daily event and I don't see presence of any of our soldiers to stop , or even prevent it . Arabs , with their believes , culture , style of life and long history have their own way of existence and we don't need , or must not to change it . It's for themselves - not for us , distanced by time and ocean .
Look at the world now - wherever Americans were acting without UN and trying to "restore" , or establish the New Order , they faced failures . What they do instead ? They protect Big Businesses with military installations , where people of entire world DO NOT ACCEPT IT ! Now do you know , why "anti-American" sentiment is so strong ? Isn't that enough to understand wrongly designated motives of doing business under umbrella of "fixing" everybody's problems ? International policies are so different everywhere and are based on different principals of the people and their land . It should be recognized too . At least I do .

"jm21ddd15
To my knowledge, the U.S. has a voluntary Army. Nobody got "sent" that wasn't aware of what they were doing. Myself and my son are both Military vets who "volunteered" and don't regret it, unlike some in the White House that never enlisted.An you , send young boys to war???

Before your "voluntary" deployment , I would look at the map and check geography on focused terrain first . Did you ever recognized origin of hijackers , who were RESPONSIBLE for that attack ? If not , let me remind you :
15 of the 19 were citizens of Saudi Arabia ! The 2 others were from the United Arab Emirates , one from Egypt and one from Lebanon. So , you landed in wrong Airport ... voluntarily (?) . I can't not comment such a explanation . Or , maybe unknowingly you were dispatched to protect mines of much needed now LITHIUM ? Why under your and son's presence , production of opium has been increased and flawlessly enriched American market ? Is it OK , because of American demand for heroin , or what ? What did you do , when Taliban destroyed so many of your installations and transports of American weaponry ? Finally , what's the result of your "mission" ? Another un-complished one ? It doesn't sound right .

"stroguy"
You see - we have different opinions and backgrounds , but I do not tirade you in such a passion , which you unleash so often . You already presented your bully character and that still didn't impressed me . I detected , you are first class racist , hiding behind your American "values" , and someone else around are not worth your privileged status ( of what ? ) . It is also proving , how small you are . If you trying to convince me , that your "truth" is more valuable , so be it . It would be senseless to argue . You must live with your "adopted knowledge" and stay with your affiliated "plain dumb folks with college degrees" , which will make you feel better and maybe respected (?). For me your comment don't means much , so if will not irritate my integrity , I will always try to skip it .

So, you really believe all that crap in your post? I'm happy for you. Your the only person I know that does. Anyway, this Thread is going too far away form motorcycles and the F6, which is why I joined in the first place. Have a good day in your world.

[stroguy]

I think diarrhea was an astute observation. Yes jm a simple post to link people to a celebration of America turned to diarrhea. On to the motorcycles.

[53driver]

Les - either UBL (Usama Bin Laden) or the head of ISIS (whoever holds that post this week) or Iran's caliphate, or Iraq's leader or anyone else being invited to dinner does NOT equate to a foreign policy.
You have obviously no clue as to what is involved in foreign policy. Especially when it comes to treaties of alliance & protection we have with other countries. And yes, I too believe that gas should be $10 a gallon - like the rest of the world.

And when I - not shooter (let's get the rest of the names correct) - asked you to elaborate on your "foreign policy," you went off on tangents as a response so I am forced to surmise that you either have no legitimate response or this is a game to you. Rest assured that it is no game to me and forces me to conclude that you are in way over your head. This would be a good example of not knowing when to "keep silence and let others believe you the fool, than to open your mouth and leave no doubt."

Bottom line: I gave you a blank canvas to paint in whatever rainbow colors the mechanics of your global kumbaya hypotheses and you think a dinner party will resolve the issues.
Not even a legitimate attempt at a solution. FAIL.

It is obvious English is not your first language.
It is obvious from your views that you are from a country in Europe.
I reckon your family suffered in WWII and you have the US military or Russian military (I'm guessing the latter since you have such a chip on your shoulder towards the US military) to thank to end the Nazi suffering - and they did it without the UN's blessing.

[shooter]

53 I have never encountered anyone like Limo in my life. He is so full of himself and full of shyt that it blows my mind. The only thing that comes out is useless drivel. Most of the time it doesn't even make sense or relate to the subject at hand. I now have him on ignore. No matter if you say black he will say white , you say hot he will say cold. Its maddening. They probably kicked him out of his previous country.

[BIGLRY]

53 I have never encountered anyone like Limo in my life. He is so full of himself and full of shyt that it blows my mind. The only thing that comes out is useless drivel. Most of the time it doesn't even make sense or relate to the subject at hand. I now have him on ignore. No matter if you say black he will say white , you say hot he will say cold. Its maddening. They probably kicked him out of his previous country.
:icon_laugh::icon_lol:Spot on shooter & 53driver I'm just setting here 'popcorn and coke' Sorry, this thread is just to easy to :stirthepot: so I woun't.:301:

[shooter]

Don't hold back Larry. A useful comment would be helpful. Some of Limo's stuff I read 3 times and it still don't make sense.

[Bill1584]

Don't hold back Larry. A useful comment would be helpful. Some of Limo's stuff I read 3 times and it still don't make sense.

One can distill Limo's musings down to a fairly simple theme: The US is bad (or stupid?), and if we'd all just think peaceful thoughts then there would be no more need for bombs, guns or disagreement. You guys have nailed it and called him on it. The world is far more complicated than he makes it out, and the US's obligations world-wide are vastly more complex than he seems to understand. More so than I understand on the whole, if I am honest. I commend you for your patience.

As has been written here, I don't like hearing the 'love it or leave it' talk. Instead I usually just point folks to the voting booth. If you don't like it, then change it. With some, however, hearing talk of this kind and severity makes me wonder why they stay. If I found myself someplace I didn't like or respect, I'd likely leave. I sure as hell wouldn't lecture those who did like it there about why they should be ashamed of themselves.

For the record, I think it would be safe to assert that there are no US troops in the oil fields of Saudi Arabia. Those guys are kinda sensitive to outsiders getting into their business.

[Airborne06]

Les, your views make a lot of assumptions and are quite conspiratory, with the USA always cast as the bad guy. The whole bit about everything being about oil is a favorite old line of the nutjobs; if America wanted the oil so bad, we'd just take it. But is that what we do? (no)

How about seeing the positives and giving the benefit of the doubt to this country... the one you chose to come to? It's impolite to take a shit in the house of your hosts. :icon_biggrin:

You know what they say about mud-wrestling with a pig......

[53driver]

You know what they say about mud-wrestling with a pig......

I was thinking that too.....

[BIGLRY]

I was thinking that too.....+2

[Limoles]

http://article.wn.com/view/2015/04/15/Are_Those_Who_Defy_the_US_Irrational_or_Mad/

https://www.globalpolicy.org/invasion-and-war/atrocities-and-criminal-homicides-.html

http://www.alternet.org/story/56761/confessions_from_u.s._soldiers_in_iraq_on_the_brut al_treatment_of_civilians

http://whowhatwhy.org/2014/03/19/crimes-police-aggression-increasing/

http://warisacrime.org/iraq

http://truth-out.org/archive/component/k2/item/88996:iraq-vets-coverage-of-atrocities-is-too-little-too-late

http://www.allgov.com/news/us-and-the-world/what-do-we-know-about-the-torture-photos-obama-refuses-to-release-150505?news=856402



"All truths are easy to understand once they are discovered; the point is to discover them".
Galileo Galilei

[BIGLRY]

http://article.wn.com/view/2015/04/15/Are_Those_Who_Defy_the_US_Irrational_or_Mad/

https://www.globalpolicy.org/invasion-and-war/atrocities-and-criminal-homicides-.html

http://www.alternet.org/story/56761/confessions_from_u.s._soldiers_in_iraq_on_the_brut al_treatment_of_civilians

http://whowhatwhy.org/2014/03/19/crimes-police-aggression-increasing/

http://warisacrime.org/iraq

http://truth-out.org/archive/component/k2/item/88996:iraq-vets-coverage-of-atrocities-is-too-little-too-late

http://www.allgov.com/news/us-and-the-world/what-do-we-know-about-the-torture-photos-obama-refuses-to-release-150505?news=856402



"All truths are easy to understand once they are discovered; the point is to discover them".
Galileo GalileiSo Limoles is one to assume with all the links you have provided you believe that the U.S. is and has been the only country to currently commit atrocities against others or throughout its history? Or is it your way justifying your myopic, lopsided view of this country?
Man's inhumanity to man has been going on since he climbed down from the trees and walked across Africa, it is only in the 20th century humans have developed the ability to wipe out all life on earth with the push of a button. The U.S. helped stop a world war with this knowledge and has never used it again. Now in your self moralistic views opine nothing other than web links which as everyone knows "everything on the web is 100% true and must be believed as the gospel"
I challenge you to write a subjective paper expressing your reasons why the U.S. is not the greatest country in the world and who you feel is.
Is the U.S perfect? NO, but show me one that is or even comes close to its compassion, giving nature and over all respect for human life and dignity for all.

Respectfully,
Larry Royal

[Hornblower]

+1 BIGLRY :yes:

[stroguy]

My God to be so freakin hollow. Programmed by the pap of the interweb. No need to be right because someone else claimed it, said it, vowed it. I cannot think of a more miserable way to proceed than to first not be beguiled by a country that has welcomed you and second to have your strings strung by conspiracy theorists galore. Ugh!

[stroguy]

Make time for this numnutz. You seem to only have time to become intellectually more superior to us by concentrating on all of the negatives.


https://youtu.be/TzLN4dzUgj0



http://englishrussia.com/2011/07/21/the-afghanistan-of-the-50s-60s/

The taliban made it better right?



http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Military/2014/1001/1-400-US-troops-to-Liberia-building-hospitals-not-treating-Ebola-patients

Freakin killer Marines




http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2015/05/11/tsarnaev-sentencing-boston-bombing-prejean/27113135/

Just giving America a taste of the fire it started....right?

More of the just horrible looking conditions they suffered in the mid 1900's

http://peopleus.blogspot.com/2012/07/afghanistan-in-1950s-60s-and-70s.html



Bastards, how dare they try and help.

http://www.politicsdaily.com/2010/01/19/haiti-disaster-opens-new-front-for-overstretched-u-s-military/



KILLERS

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/03/14/956242/-U-S-Navy-Supports-Tsunami-Damaged-Areas-photo-diary



Sons of bitches.

http://www.philippineflightnetwork.com/2013/11/us-military-first-on-scene-to-aid-in.html



Make time to see the good. You'll smile more. Have a good life.

[BIGLRY]

My God to be so freakin hollow. Programmed by the pap of the interweb. No need to be right because someone else claimed it, said it, vowed it. I cannot think of a more miserable way to proceed than to first not be beguiled by a country that has welcomed you and second to have your strings strung by conspiracy theorists galore. Ugh!And that my friend is really it 13869in a nut shell!


and to limoles who doesn't seem to like to think for himself I might add
13870

[jm21ddd15]

:yes: Well Said :yes:

[53driver]

..article from Kurt Schlicter today. California lawyer, Army Veteran, Stand Up Comic.
I'm with him. No links - just read.


Kurt Schlichter | May 11, 2015

I damn sure didn’t go to war for this country twice to come home and be told by a bunch of homely chicks with daddy issues, effete literary fops scandalized by the notion of resistance to Third World pathologies, and nimrod sons of politicians playing at journalism what I can and can’t say. And I don’t think most Americans are ready to have everything they speak, write, or think perused for possible hate criminality by these same goose-stepping creeps.
We’d rather die than “live” on our knees, begging permission to exercise the right God gave us to say whatever we damn well please, whenever we damn well please, and in the manner we damn well please. And those who want to shut us up better be equally committed if they want to succeed.
After Garland, they went too far. They showed their hand and their goal, a world where they decide who gets to say what. Imagine the same hysterical social justice drama queens who shriek about microaggressions getting to decide what you can and can’t say. Just understand, you fascist bastards, that if you want to be Nazis, you’ll need to do what the Nazis did and find some armed thugs – yeah, I’m using the word “thugs” whether you like it or not – to come stop us. Tell them to wear Kevlar.
Garland and the sorry aftermath of terrorist apologetics that followed were a warning to every freedom-loving American, as well as an illustration of what one freedom-loving American with training and a Glock can do against the forces of totalitarianism. These jihadi savages tried to silence and intimidate all free Americans. They failed.
Progressives mutter without conviction about how they can’t support violence, but … but … but, in fact, they do support violence. It’s not just their chilling with bomb-planting guys around the neighborhood and free passes for the looters in Ferguson and Baltimore. They support whatever it takes to silence us.
When the Democrats in Congress vote to repeal the First Amendment, or when they babble about outlawing what they label “hate speech,” what these leftist elitists seek to do is to empower a government they control to send armed men to stop us from saying what they have determined we may not say. They can’t stand up to the truth we speak; they have to suppress it or scamper away like roaches caught in the light.
No. You see, we aren’t giving up our right of free speech or, for that matter, any other rights you leftist schmucks deem inconvenient.
Those miserable losers in Garland weren’t just a couple of carcasses. Shot down in the street by a free American who was not intimidated, who was not afraid, who absolutely, positively was not going to back down even when outnumbered and outgunned, their dead bodies are a symbol. They are a symbol of our resolve, proof that we will not surrender, we will not submit, and we will not allow our God-given rights to be stolen from us by anyone, not Seventh Century savages, not Gucci-wearing liberal narcissists, and not twisted social justice warriorettes taking out on the rest of humanity their lingering disappointment that no boy wanted to be seen with them at the prom.
To the gutless and cowardly who would gladly submit to dhimmitude, whether imposed by the jihadi creeps or the progressive cadres, we can say only that we pity you. We pity the fact that every day you have to wake up and look in the mirror and see the face of a man, or woman, or whichever of the 567 other gender identities the freakshow left has manufactured, who is more concerned with personal safety than with personal dignity. Pathetic.
Maybe preserving your life is worth living as a slave, but we reject your craven choice. God did not put us on this Earth to be the minions of some oligarchy of malignant punks, obedient and afraid. You want to clasp a figurative collar around our necks? You better hire a whole bunch of dudes who are a whole a lot better at close quarter combat than those clowns in Garland. And you sure won’t find any tactically proficient future stormtroopers in the local university’s Womyns’ Studies Department or sipping cosmos at some Manhattan cocktail party.
You want to turn America into the fascist state of your dreams? Remember Lexington and Concord? No, you don’t, because you were too busy taking courses in Socialist Tap Dance to squeeze in a history course. So let me break it down for you: You’ll need to fight. And you putzes don’t have the skill or the guts to do it.
The jihadis can’t fight, and you leftists won’t. You progressives thought you could just slowly nibble away at our rights, gnawing off a bit here and a bit there, slowly, so we wouldn’t notice. You thought you could shame, bully, and browbeat us into the figurative cattle cars for carriage off to the giant reeducation camp you wanted to make of our culture. Who needed men in black with guns? We were supposed to willingly, even eagerly, submit. But that’s not going to happen.
Oh, you came so close. For so long, we wrongly imagined that your lies about racism, sexism, Islamophobia, and all the rest were just part of some big misunderstanding. Sure, we knew you were wrong, that we were being falsely accused, but we thought you were at least sincere, if misguided. Except now the mask is off.
Racism? You don’t care. Ask Clarence Thomas about your love of minorities who don’t toe your line.
Sexism? You don’t care. Ask any of Bill Clinton’s victims, who you eagerly sacrificed to save your progressive knight.
Homophobia? Poverty? Corporate abuses? Civil rights? You care nothing about any of them. You leftists just want control. You trash gays who get between you and power, and ignore the gays being murdered in the Middle East because that oppression isn’t useful to you. You keep the poor poor and addicted to your paltry handouts so you can maintain a docile voting bloc. Corporate abuses are terrible right up until the big companies start paying off your candidates. And civil rights? Gimme a break. The First Amendment stopped being useful back in January 2009, so now you’re eager to drown it like Mary Jo Kopechne.
We’re done. You fascists, whether Islamo- or liberal, want to shut us up? Then you better be ready to rumble, because submission isn’t one of the options. We will speak free or die.

[shooter]

Guys the total crap that rolls out of that mans mouth is unbelievable. I have watched this infidel for months. I'm convinced he is a card carrying communist and I urge you guys to quit responding to him and never acknowledge his existence again. His sole purpose on this forum is to disrupt and destroy our ideals. We live in the greatest country on the planet. We set the standards for everyone else. We are envied and yet hated. They are chasing our tails guys. Lady Liberty's dress may have blown up a little but she will push it down and continue to set the pace. We are the world , and the world is nothing without us. God Bless the USA.

[srt8-in-largo]

Disappointed Les; I thought you were better than a propagandist.

[stroguy]

Nice Steve.

[stroguy]

Thank you Larry.

[Limoles]

Disappointed Les; I thought you were better than a propagandist.


I'm not better , than anybody else , but if you tell me , how to explain presence and mission of American "heroes" in those Middle East locations , I'll try to continue and find the proper motives of counterpart's naive thinking ? Don't tell me , that thoughtlessly repeated "merits" and past involvement in WWII gave them that "privilege" of justifying pre-empty wars . It's rather indicating , you are the victim of domestic propaganda , which is nothing but agitation for beating drums of ( another ) war .

You probably missed that Congressional Hearing :

"US Army General Wesley Clark in August of 2001, said : We are reminded that many wars and major military theater operations are planned years or sometimes even decades in advance and that the excuses to justify them are likely fabricated. In this short speech that General Clark gave more than 10 years ago, he stated that the US had already planned to invade Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, Somalia, Sudan, Libya and Iran. We already know that Iraq has fallen, that Libya has been taken out, that there is a brutal ongoing war in Syria and in the Sudan now, that there has been ongoing war in Somalia since 2009, and that war in Iran now seems inevitable. Furthermore, a quick look at the map below shows that the only two countries important to the control of oil transport routes in the Red Sea, the Persian Gulf and the Mediterranean Sea not on Wesley Clark’s 2001 list are Egypt, a country in which the Arab Spring originated and former President Mubarak has already been ousted, and Saudi Arabia, a long-time standing US ally. But could there possibly be another much more important commodity than oil that is really the driving force behind these interventions? Upon deeper investigation, it also seems highly likely that the Western global banking cartel has been involved in some capacity in the industrial-military complex planning of these invasions and government overthrows in Africa and the Middle East due to the peculiarly timed nature of these events".

So , what's missing now ? Follow the continuous fabrications for Iran' occupation . The only problem of temporary upholding it is NO EVIDENCE of any endangerment , which could affect "your freedom" .

[Bill1584]

So Limoles is one to assume with all the links you have provided you believe that the U.S. is and has been the only country to currently commit atrocities against others or throughout its history? Or is it your way justifying your myopic, lopsided view of this country?
Man's inhumanity to man has been going on since he climbed down from the trees and walked across Africa, it is only in the 20th century humans have developed the ability to wipe out all life on earth with the push of a button. The U.S. helped stop a world war with this knowledge and has never used it again. Now in your self moralistic views opine nothing other than web links which as everyone knows "everything on the web is 100% true and must be believed as the gospel"
I challenge you to write a subjective paper expressing your reasons why the U.S. is not the greatest country in the world and who you feel is.
Is the U.S perfect? NO, but show me one that is or even comes close to its compassion, giving nature and over all respect for human life and dignity for all.

Respectfully,
Larry Royal

Damn right, Larry. And thanks.

[bigbird]

Is the U.S perfect? NO, but show me one that is or even comes close to its compassion, giving nature and over all respect for human life and dignity for all.


That's easy.
Just look to your northern border.

[bigbird]

I have watched this infidel for months. I'm convinced he is a card carrying communist and I urge you guys to quit responding to him and never acknowledge his existence again.

I thought the USA was the most tolerant and compassionate and respectful country in the world?
Isn't freedom of speech something to cherish?
You guys can all put Les on your blocked list if you don't want to see his posts.
BTW, are card carrying Commies still a threat to the USA?

[stroguy]

We are and yes it is. Are you implying we are asking to shut up the anti-American fool? We aren't. Being a moron, a disrespectful boob, an ignoramus, pissing on the flag, insulting your neighbor are all guaranteed as well. Some can't handle the ball being hit back at them harder than they hit it. To prove a fool just keep their gums flapping.

Pretty sure he is ignored by plenty.

[stroguy]

That's easy.
Just look to your northern border.

Agreed. But has Canada spent the enormity of tax payer dollars to guarantee the statement by Larry? Not even close.

[Bill1584]

I thought the USA was the most tolerant and compassionate and respectful country in the world?
Isn't freedom of speech something to cherish?
You guys can all put Les on your blocked list if you don't want to see his posts.
BTW, are card carrying Commies still a threat to the USA?

This isn't about his freedom of speech. This is about his audience. If you look at the demographics here, you will find a fair concentration of folks who take their nationalism pretty seriously. It is a known factor, to both of you. It is needling at its most inane, since there is zero chance he will make a well-received point. Again, he knows this. Same deal with the guns. Most everyone on this forum is very pro-gun, and most avail themselves to the extent they can. Since this is known, why not needle away? The reaction to either can be, and was, anticipated. To me these threads are like car wrecks, in that I don't really want to see but I cannot help looking. Perhaps I actually do want to see.... He feels folks are being led around by our noses by some kind of propaganda machine. The feeling is mutual.

I have no intention of blocking anyone over these things. Frankly, I do enjoy some of what he says, and there are obviously many other active threads on this forum.

[shooter]

Bird I only tolerate you because you do have a good thought once in a while. And you can agree to disagree. But let's be real , your economy is dependent on the US. And you guys still bow to the queen. You ride our coattails and then you trash us. No one likes us but they all want to be us. I'll just leave you with one thought. Without us your country can't survive. The world couldnt survive without our economy and our food. Us? We don't need anyone. We can make our own way. Other than South America , we are the only country that can feed itself. So pat yourself on the back while you eat our food and spend our money and enjoy our protection.

[shooter]

I thought the USA was the most tolerant and compassionate and respectful country in the world?
Isn't freedom of speech something to cherish?
You guys can all put Les on your blocked list if you don't want to see his posts.
BTW, are card carrying Commies still a threat to the USA?
We are tolerant and compassionate to a fault. We need more Ronald Reagans to run this country. Unfortunately our leaders are Wussies. However we still manage to get the job done in spite of them.

[srt8-in-largo]

I'm not better , than anybody else , but if you tell me , how to explain presence and mission of American "heroes" in those Middle East locations , I'll try to continue and find the proper motives of counterpart's naive thinking ? Don't tell me , that thoughtlessly repeated "merits" and past involvement in WWII gave them that "privilege" of justifying pre-empty wars . It's rather indicating , you are the victim of domestic propaganda , which is nothing but agitation for beating drums of ( another ) war .

You probably missed that Congressional Hearing :

"US Army General Wesley Clark in August of 2001, said : We are reminded that many wars and major military theater operations are planned years or sometimes even decades in advance and that the excuses to justify them are likely fabricated. In this short speech that General Clark gave more than 10 years ago, he stated that the US had already planned to invade Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, Somalia, Sudan, Libya and Iran. We already know that Iraq has fallen, that Libya has been taken out, that there is a brutal ongoing war in Syria and in the Sudan now, that there has been ongoing war in Somalia since 2009, and that war in Iran now seems inevitable. Furthermore, a quick look at the map below shows that the only two countries important to the control of oil transport routes in the Red Sea, the Persian Gulf and the Mediterranean Sea not on Wesley Clark’s 2001 list are Egypt, a country in which the Arab Spring originated and former President Mubarak has already been ousted, and Saudi Arabia, a long-time standing US ally. But could there possibly be another much more important commodity than oil that is really the driving force behind these interventions? Upon deeper investigation, it also seems highly likely that the Western global banking cartel has been involved in some capacity in the industrial-military complex planning of these invasions and government overthrows in Africa and the Middle East due to the peculiarly timed nature of these events".

So , what's missing now ? Follow the continuous fabrications for Iran' occupation . The only problem of temporary upholding it is NO EVIDENCE of any endangerment , which could affect "your freedom" .

You profess to having an open mind and claim to be a logical thinker... but yet your mind is closed to anything that goes against your *feelings*. And that's fine, but I wouldn't claim to have an understanding until you can see both sides of the argument. I'm sure you think you see all aspects and angles and motivations, but being so narrowly focused on one viewpoint makes it clear that you don't.

Further, let's be honest and say that your opinions are driven by your feelings, not actual facts or conditions. And your feelings are driven by pseudo-journalistic articles, out of context quotes, and inflamatory pictures. This is no longer a discussion using reason and rationality; this is a release of deep seated FEELINGS within you. Do you even recognize that?



I thought the USA was the most tolerant and compassionate and respectful country in the world?
Isn't freedom of speech something to cherish?
You guys can all put Les on your blocked list if you don't want to see his posts.
BTW, are card carrying Commies still a threat to the USA?

No, no, no Bird. You clearly don't understand the USA :icon_biggrin:

The folks who stand on the soapbox and loudly proclaim to have tolerance, compassion, and respect enjoy the status of being LABELLED as such... but when it comes time to practice those virtues, they'll have no part of it. The funny thing is folks like this fail to recognize their own hyprocrisy.

Joking aside, the silliness of the low-IQ and the nutjob crowds does get old; such is the price paid by free nations eh.

[stroguy]

It's big business today to make people feel guilty for being an American. You must be a bigot or a racist or any other multitude of names if you take pride in America and the good she has done for the world. I won't stand for it.....sorry if that upsets someone.



EDIT..........just to add, 6 KILLER US Marines are missing as well as their helicopter in Nepal. I think they were there rounding up Nepalese to put in internment camps to be sold later as slaves.

[Limoles]

Now is no need for damage control .
Today all world is alerted and willing to help .
It's a different mission , called HUMANITARIAN .

Thanks to another countries , incl. USA - these people will receive NECESSARY help :

Bangladesh
China
India
Algeria
Australia
Austria
Azerbaijan
Belgium
Bhutan
Brazil
Brunei
Bulgaria
Canada
Colombia
Czech Republic
Denmark
Egypt
Estonia
Finland
France
Germany
Greece
Hong Kong
Indonesia
Iran
Ireland
Israel
Italy
Japan
South Korea
Kuwait
Latvia
Lithuania
Malaysia
Mexico
Monaco
Netherlands
New Zealand
Norway
Pakistan
Palestine
Philippines
Poland
Qatar
Romania
Russia
Serbia
Singapore
Slovenia
Spain
South Africa
Sri Lanka
Switzerland
Sweden
Taiwan
Thailand
Tunisia
Turkey
United Arab Emirates
United Kingdom
United States
Vatican City
Venezuela
Vietnam

Hopefully American helicopter will be found ...

[Bill1584]

Now is no need for damage control .
Today all world is alerted and willing to help .
It's a different mission , called HUMANITARIAN .

Thanks to another countries , incl. USA - these people will receive NECESSARY help :

Bangladesh
China
India

...

Venezuela
Vietnam

Hopefully American helicopter will be found ...

Dang. I assume you can/will provide references listing the donated time, food, water, clothing, tents, manpower, helicopters, etc from Serbia, Latvia and Tunisia. In the face of actual US casualties this is the best you can do? Yeah, hopefully the American helicopter will be found, along with the Marines and the two Nepalese they were evacuating to safety. Based solely on your presentation here, and earlier comments, I personally doubt your sincerity. Palestine? Lemme see the links.

[Limoles]

Despite historically documented sufferings , massive carpet bombings , napalm burnings and another barbaric methods of killings , Vietnam is one of those countries , which recovered already and proudly helping another people . I think , it's their nature . It's a different character of nation and its people .

[stroguy]

Yes you are right, those communists were horrible there, beheading, mutilations, murder. Glad the US stepped in to stop that sickness. But diplomats thought they knew how to fight a war and look what happened.

[Bill1584]

Once again, Ace. Links. Evidence. Please provide links indicating the participation in Nepal of Serbia, Latvia, Tunisia, and Palestine. If you cannot, please preserve what credibility to have left and admit it. Save the rhetoric and send the links.

[Bill1584]

Yes you are right, those communists were horrible there, beheading, mutilations, murder. Glad the US stepped in to stop that sickness. But diplomats thought they knew how to fight a war and look what happened.

Why am I so incensed by all this? Relatives I never knew because of WWII, Nam? My family lost no one in Korea, though my dad built bridges there. Why can I not let this pass?

[Limoles]

Yes you are right, those communists were horrible there, beheading, mutilations, murder. Glad the US stepped in to stop that sickness. But diplomats thought they knew how to fight a war and look what happened.

About 15 tears ago ( or so ) , Atlantic City was hosting Convention of American Red Cross Nurses . I was in charge of driving one of the leading Nurse , who served in Vietnam about 3 years . We were talking about misery of war and wasted human life . Not being sure about numbers of casualties , I asked her :
- Could you refresh my memory and provide the toll of killed and wounded Americans ? There were 58,000 of deaths and 75,000 disabled , or vice versa ?
After prolonged silence , she answered : YOU WANT TO KNOW THE TRUTH ? .... NOBODY CAME BACK ALIVE !!!!!

I'm pretty sure , you will never understand , what kind of message was delivered to my contemplations .
Ironically , on the one of the following intersections , miserably looking man , who was begging for change , had sign posted on the piece of board , which stated : "Homeless Viet Vet - please help" . And then I realized , I'm in USA .

Should I explain you more ? Should I scream to heavens , shouting : ANY WAR IS A HELL AND ANY WAR IS STUPID ?
Or maybe it will make you lough , because you "think better" , who is classified to be alive , or to be dead !!!

Shame on you , Warmongers ! Shame on your twisted mentality , fueled by propaganda of "superiority" over another human bean . Nobody gave you any rights to judge others , except giving advices , claiming that Mc Donald garbage and cheap bear is best for all world consumption .

So , whoever was attempting to hurt senses of my REAL PATRIOTISM , is fool and has been presenting false understandings of existence . I'll wave the flag with related emotions , until some jerk might try to convince me , that aggressive , unjust wars and dreams of "Full Spectrum Dominance " is the only way of survival .

[srt8-in-largo]

Do you believe you're the only one in this thread who knows that war is hell?

Do you believe everybody here are war mongers and prefer battle over diplomacy?

Do you believe you have a monopoly on the true horrors of death and destruction?


Rest assured that at the core of everybody's heart is a desire to NOT go to war... regardless of the drivel that some websites may write :icon_biggrin:

[srt8-in-largo]

...

The folks who stand on the soapbox and loudly proclaim to have tolerance, compassion, and respect enjoy the status of being LABELLED as such... but when it comes time to practice those virtues, they'll have no part of it. The funny thing is folks like this fail to recognize their own hyprocrisy.

Joking aside, the silliness of the low-IQ and the nutjob crowds does get old; such is the price paid by free nations eh.

For the record, my comment here was NOT directed towards anyone in this thread.

[Bill1584]

About 15 tears ago ( or so ) , Atlantic City was hosting Convention of American Red Cross Nurses . I was in charge of driving one of the leading Nurse , who served in Vietnam about 3 years . We were talking about misery of war and wasted human life . Not being sure about numbers of casualties , I asked her :
- Could you refresh my memory and provide the toll of killed and wounded Americans ? There were 58,000 of deaths and 75,000 disabled , or vice versa ?
After prolonged silence , she answered : YOU WANT TO KNOW THE TRUTH ? .... NOBODY CAME BACK ALIVE !!!!!

I'm pretty sure , you will never understand , what kind of message was delivered to my contemplations .
Ironically , on the one of the following intersections , miserably looking man , who was begging for change , had sign posted on the piece of board , which stated : "Homeless Viet Vet - please help" . And then I realized , I'm in USA .

Should I explain you more ? Should I scream to heavens , shouting : ANY WAR IS A HELL AND ANY WAR IS STUPID ?
Or maybe it will make you lough , because you "think better" , who is classified to be alive , or to be dead !!!

Shame on you , Warmongers ! Shame on your twisted mentality , fueled by propaganda of "superiority" over another human bean . Nobody gave you any rights to judge others , except giving advices , claiming that Mc Donald garbage and cheap bear is best for all world consumption .

So , whoever was attempting to hurt senses of my REAL PATRIOTISM , is fool and has been presenting false understandings of existence . I'll wave the flag with related emotions , until some jerk might try to convince me , that aggressive , unjust wars and dreams of "Full Spectrum Dominance " is the only way of survival .

Serbia, Latvia, Tunisia and Palestine benevolent involvement in Nepal. Links please. No one is preaching war. Only the long arm of US strength reaching out to help. Thank your lucky stars you got off the boat here and achieved your dream. Right here in the USA. Thanks might be a better response.

Links please.

[Limoles]

Do you believe you're the only one in this thread who knows that war is hell?

Do you believe everybody here are war mongers and prefer battle over diplomacy?

Do you believe you have a monopoly on the true horrors of death and destruction?


Rest assured that at the core of everybody's heart is a desire to NOT go to war... regardless of the drivel that some websites may write :icon_biggrin:

George - I really enjoy your intelligence , your posted sentences , which are kind , persuasive and written in pure , eloquent English . I also learn from you and for benefits of my technical skills too. I might never reach your level , but trying is the best , what I can do . The answer to your questions is difficult , because not many responders participate in our debate . Looks , like after reading some ranted and vulgar posts , they are afraid to be categorized and judged by few "self proclaimed leaders of debate" , who destroying the beauty of differently provided forms of thinking. If you really want to know , who believe , or who doesn't of "whatever" it might be , let's open new thread , where one can anonymously vote for multiple issues , related to "peace and war" . Similarly to "what ages" , or "types of chosen exhaust systems" , etc. It will be fair and extremely educational . We all are different with various mind set up , but we need to accept each other , no matter what the presentations of our world's view is . I'll be the first , who will vote for unconditional peace and tolerance between people ( incl. family members ), countries , races , faith and believes . I did the same for provocative , but very smart question posted by BigBird . You can recall the thunderstorms and fire , which still didn't change my "awareness" to the evident and cultural threats of many , who still mandate taking "patriotic responsibilities" with guns , which presumedly is giving them some assurance of "safety" . So , let's ask some of our Moderators , or PoopScooper to set suitable composition of the questions from above .

[53driver]

.... but trying is the best , what I can do....
That's all I can ask for.


...who still mandate taking "patriotic responsibilities" with guns , which presumedly is giving them some assurance of "safety"...
I find it odd that one as masterful a debater as you claim to be, failed to even acknowledge my real life experiences, providing my family with safety, using a weapon.
When I was on the debate team, not acknowledging was judged as "agreeing."

Les - you never responded to any of my questions, or requests for the tangible manifestations of your ideologies, only picking and choosing questions from others.
Until you get "real", I cannot take your opinions, however well meaning they may be, seriously.
I've been in war.
No one wins.
Fighting evil is a tough, dirty job.
I have successfully defended my family, and shall continue to do so, with whatever means I am afforded and trained.
Academia knows not of dirty hands.

Let's get real here: your company makes a profit margin based on the financial successes of the oil companies to deliver cheaper fuel to America than the rest of the world.
What would $10/gallon gasoline do to your limo business?

[Limoles]

Once again, Ace. Links. Evidence. Please provide links indicating the participation in Nepal of Serbia, Latvia, Tunisia, and Palestine. If you cannot, please preserve what credibility to have left and admit it. Save the rhetoric and send the links.

You really trying to bash me down , which became annoying already . But since you asked me so nicely now and in response I'll fulfill your curiosity , sending the link to "requested" doubts , so please read it and find out , that World is round and GOOD PEOPLE lives everywhere , who will do the best to express their HUMANITY :

Do you need "evidence" for statistics , or human review ? By the way - Are you going up there to help , or you want to play with me with "accuracy and credibility" ? Take a deep breath and stop being a child ...


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humanitarian_response_to_the_2015_Nepal_earthquake

[Limoles]

That's all I can ask for.


I find it odd that one as masterful a debater as you claim to be, failed to even acknowledge my real life experiences, providing my family with safety, using a weapon.
When I was on the debate team, not acknowledging was judged as "agreeing."

Les - you never responded to any of my questions, or requests for the tangible manifestations of your ideologies, only picking and choosing questions from others.
Until you get "real", I cannot take your opinions, however well meaning they may be, seriously.
I've been in war.
No one wins.
Fighting evil is a tough, dirty job.
I have successfully defended my family, and shall continue to do so, with whatever means I am afforded and trained.
Academia knows not of dirty hands.

Let's get real here: your company makes a profit margin based on the financial successes of the oil companies to deliver cheaper fuel to America than the rest of the world.
What would $10/gallon gasoline do to your limo business?


I didn't - sorry , but since your questions were not so clear to me - I skipped the answers .

Gas - I was adjusting my prices of the service , when fuel was $.99 and reached up to $4,70
Now is $2,45 and incoming summer time will increase the numbers . Consumer always paying
the bill , we are only providing it . But honestly , I think , now we have to many reserves and oil
tankers are plentiful on all Oceans , waiting for another speculative directives from Wall Street ,
so they sneefing political situations around the world and play with all of us on their violins .

[bigbird]

We don't need anyone. We can make our own way. Other than South America , we are the only country that can feed itself. So pat yourself on the back while you eat our food and spend our money and enjoy our protection.


Without our oil, natural gas, electricity, and fairly soon our fresh water, the US would be reliant on the Middle East again.
You know where that got you once.

[bigbird]

Us? We don't need anyone. We can make our own way.

Not quite true.
Without Japan, your F6B wouldn't exist, and this forum wouldn't exist.
You do need japan.

[Limoles]

Not quite true.
Without Japan, your F6B wouldn't exist, and this forum wouldn't exist.
You do need japan.

Another example of reversed politics .
Ones enemies - today partners .
It requires only two to shake the hands .
Why do I love it ?

[srt8-in-largo]

We'll trade you if you take Justin Beiber back! :icon_biggrin:

[srt8-in-largo]

Without the USA occupying Japan and leading its' rehabilitation, reconstruction, and stabilization after the war, there would be no Honda.

Ain't this fun? :icon_biggrin:

[Limoles]

Without our oil, natural gas, electricity, and fairly soon our fresh water, the US would be reliant on the Middle East again.
You know where that got you once.

US doesn't need anybody ?
Really ? Experiment of GMO engineered food proved , that USA is the leader of obesity and cancer .
Big steaks and triple size of corn happened to be disastrous for our health . Need proofs ?

On the another hand :
One of my drivers , getting bitting from one ignorant American , who watched "The News" ,
( where immigration became another hot topic again ) responded : "Greengos are so funny .
If you send all Mexicans back , America look like a waste-land and one apple will cost them $10.00"

Dearest Yankees - Do not underestimate those , who build this country !!! NEVER !!!

[Limoles]

Without our oil, natural gas, electricity, and fairly soon our fresh water, the US would be reliant on the Middle East again.
You know where that got you once.

Ghadaffi , who was trying to build the biggest on the world WATER recovery system from the vast Sahara , also was found as a "threat to our security" and rest is a history . Was he a genius or imbecile ? It doesn't matter now . Water still is there , but Africa is focused on violent wars instead . Who knows , how they got their weapons and why ? Ufff - stupid politicians and dirty profits . I really hate this .

[BIGLRY]

Dang. I assume you can/will provide references listing the donated time, food, water, clothing, tents, manpower, helicopters, etc from Serbia, Latvia and Tunisia. In the face of actual US casualties this is the best you can do? Yeah, hopefully the American helicopter will be found, along with the Marines and the two Nepalese they were evacuating to safety. Based solely on your presentation here, and earlier comments, I personally doubt your sincerity. Palestine? Lemme see the links.
While he did supply the link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humanitarian_response_to_the_2015_Nepal_earthquake I find that there are quite a few country's on that list that have offered condolence's or some promise of assistance, but there no record of them actually doing anything.

Brazil, The Brazilian Ministry of External Relations released a note expressing "deep sadness" and conveying its "condolences and solidarity to the families of the victims, the people and the Government of Nepal.

Bulgaria, President Rosen Plevneliev conveyed his condolences to Nepal quake victims on behalf of the people and government of Bulgaria.

Colombia, The President of Colombia expressed total solidarity with the people of Nepal and assured them that aid would be sent.

Egypt, Egypt's government expressed condolences to Nepal's government and people in an official statement, stressing that it stood with Nepal in its diversity, paid respect to the victims and wished the wounded people a rapid recovery.

Kuwait, Sheikh Sabah Al-Ahmad Al-Jaber Al-Sabah, Emir of Kuwait, contacted the Prime Minister of Nepal to express his sorrow over the devastation in the latter country, and convey wishes for rapid recovery. The Crown Prince of Kuwait, Sheikh Nawaf Al-Ahmad Al-Jaber Al-Sabah, and the Prime Minister, Sheikh Jaber Al-Mubarak Al-Hamad Al-Sabah, sent similar messages.

Latvian Ministry of Foreign Affairs, in conjunction with Latvian senior officials, extended "deepest condolences [and] sympathies", and "wish[es] for a rapid recovery" to the people and government of Nepal.

Lithuania, President Dalia Grybauskaitë and Prime Minister Algirdas Butkevièius both offered their condolences and solidarity with the people of Nepal. Ministry of Foreign Affairs announced that there was at least 60 Lithuanian citizens in Nepal during the catastrophe and that ministry officials were working to contact them.

Palestine President Mahmoud Abbas offered his condolences to the President of Nepal, Ram Baran Yadav. Abbas expressed his and the Palestinian people's solidarity with the families of the victims, and expressed wishes for a speedy recovery for the wounded, affirming the Palestinian side's willingness to provide all possible help.

Romania President Klaus Iohannis expressed compassion and solidarity with the people affected by the earthquake in Nepal, stating that Romania joins the other countries of the world who have expressed solidarity with the authorities in Nepal and from the other countries affected by the earthquake.

Serbia Prime Minister Aleksandar Vuèiã sent his "deepest condolences … [o]n behalf of the government and the people of the Republic of Serbia" to the Prime Minister of Nepal, asserting that "[t]he Republic of Nepal and [its] citizens can always count on the sincere and friendly support of the Republic of Serbia".

Tunisia The president of Ennahda Movement in gouvernance, issued a statement it presented its condolences to the State of Nepal and the Nepalese people after this "Terrible earthquake" he says. And it called on the people to donate and help the Nepalese people, And also it called on the State to participate in the rescue efforts, and called for international forces to assume their responsibility in relief Nepal.

Venezuela The government expressed its "deep sorrow" to victims in the powerful earthquake in Nepal and offered its expertise in rescue operations.

As I look at the above list I don't see much "participation" other than paying lip service to the people of Nepal and the rest of the world.:shrug:
I'm just saying.........:301:

[Limoles]

When Polish Government and most ranking generals , flying to Smolensk in Russia to pay annual respect on the fields of mass murdered intelligence in Katyn ( WWII ) , were assassinated by Soviet "specs" . No delegation of Western powers flew for burial , claiming the dust from erupted volcano in Iceland could "disrupt" engine's performance . They forgot to ask the pilots to fly below its reach . Another sample of : "Oops , maybe next time and when we needs you". It happened in history so often already . And they still need us . F&%# politicians . How to respect them ?

[53driver]

When Polish Government and most ranking generals , flying to Smolensk in Russia to pay annual respect on the fields of mass murdered intelligence in Katyn ( WWII ) , were assassinated by Soviet "specs" . No delegation of Western powers flew for burial , claiming the dust from erupted volcano in Iceland could "disrupt" engine's performance . They forgot to ask the pilots to fly below its reach . Another sample of : "Oops , maybe next time and when we needs you". It happened in history so often already . And they still need us . F&%# politicians . How to respect them ?

If they had tweeted that they were all gay or lesbian, I'm sure the Obama Administration would have sent a cabinet member...

[53driver]

I didn't - sorry , but since your questions were not so clear to me - I skipped the answers .

How very convenient....

[stroguy]

How very convenient....


Lolololololol

[shooter]

Without our oil, natural gas, electricity, and fairly soon our fresh water, the US would be reliant on the Middle East again.
You know where that got you once.
Not true. We are just using yours till it runs out. Then we will use ours.

[shooter]

Not quite true.
Without Japan, your F6B wouldn't exist, and this forum wouldn't exist.
You do need japan.

I'll buy a HD if it means getting rid of you.

[bigbird]

Not true. We are just using yours till it runs out. Then we will use ours.

And you wonder why terrorists train on your soil.

[bigbird]

I'll buy a HD if it means getting rid of you.

We both know neither is going to happen.
Besides, without me, you're left with just Les to rag on.
Boring.

[shooter]

For the record, my comment here was NOT directed towards anyone in this thread.

Oh sure George , I know you meant me.:joke:

[srt8-in-largo]

Oh sure George , I know you meant me.:joke:

Haha. After thinking about it, I thought you might think that. But no I didn't mean you or anybody else; it's a general comment and I see it from both conservatives and liberals.

IMO, the dirtbags in both parties have stunk up the joint and I'd be embarrassed to be associated with either of them. I'm gonna start my own party for other guys like me who are fed up with the current state of politics... I'll call it the Georgitarians :icon_biggrin:

[Limoles]

Haha. After thinking about it, I thought you might think that. But no I didn't mean you or anybody else; it's a general comment and I see it from both conservatives and liberals.

IMO, the dirtbags in both parties have stunk up the joint and I'd be embarrassed to be associated with either of them. I'm gonna start my own party for other guys like me who are fed up with the current state of politics... I'll call it the Georgitarians :icon_biggrin:

Undocumented immigrants will love it . For them make it simpler - GEORGIANITOS sounds better .
Since you will eliminate some stupid and archaic programs , you can nominate me already for the Secretary of Treasury Dept . position . You need good , proven businessmen around - not some lousy firearms bandits , or warmongers .

[shooter]

Haha. After thinking about it, I thought you might think that. But no I didn't mean you or anybody else; it's a general comment and I see it from both conservatives and liberals.

IMO, the dirtbags in both parties have stunk up the joint and I'd be embarrassed to be associated with either of them. I'm gonna start my own party for other guys like me who are fed up with the current state of politics... I'll call it the Georgitarians :icon_biggrin:

I like Shooterublcans better.

[Limoles]

I like Shooterublcans better.


EEEEH - Foreigners can misspell and call SHOE LUBRICANTS :icon_biggrin::icon_biggrin::icon_biggrin:

[srt8-in-largo]

:crackup: