What is linked brakes

[Greg O]

What is linked brakes, and will my new 2013 have it.

[ths61]

"... the linked braking system providing impressive power. Pressure from its three-piston calipers is firm and steady without being grabby while providing great feel to riders at the lever. Honda's Combined Braking System, with three-piston calipers front and back, has a second master cylinder and a three-stage proportional control valve (PCV) to operate the calipers in tandem. The front runs dual floating 296mm discs, and a good squeeze on the front brake lever activates the outer two pistons of the front right-side caliper and the center piston of the front left-side caliper while the secondary master cylinder and an inline proportioning valve activate the outer two pistons of the rear caliper. The rear brake pedal operates the center piston of the rear brake caliper, the center piston of the front right-side brake caliper and the outer two pistons of the front left-side caliper. It is the kind of system where riders get a good sense of the calipers biting into the disc when they squeeze the brake lever and feel the effects of smooth, even braking. Honda accomplishes this without much dive in the fork, the 45mm cartridge unit sporting an anti-dive system while utilizing the same internals, damping and springs as the Gold Wing. ..."

2013 F6B Review (http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/117/15452/motorcycle-article/2013-honda-gold-wing-f6b-first-ride.aspx)

HTH and yes, your 2013 does have linked brakes.

[BIGLRY]

YES
http://ixxra.org/braking%20system/rearbrakeop.jpg

http://ixxra.org/braking%20system/frontbrakeop.jpg

[srt8-in-largo]

I'm not sure if I'm diggin this feature... the bike sure seems to stop on a dime though.

Only thing I don't like, is sometimes I press the rear brake lightly, as if I'm slowly rolling to a red light, and it makes the front brakes "vibrate" or "rattle" or something.

[srt8-in-largo]

What is linked brakes, and will my new 2013 have it.

Oh, and yes! Your 2013 and mine has it :icon_biggrin:

It's exactly as the name implies; when you press one brake, front or rear, some braking occurs in the other system.

[opas ride]

I really never understood this issue very well, but the damn things work and Honda has been using "linked brakes" on the Goldwings for several years with great success...I suppose some could argue that ABS are better and perhaps they are, but I have had no issues with the brakes on my F6B and it stops just fine for me......Mine is a 2013 model...

[53driver]

Only thing I don't like, is sometimes I press the rear brake lightly, as if I'm slowly rolling to a red light, and it makes the front brakes "vibrate" or "rattle" or something.
Okay..that's kind of a "whoa" thing......Mine definitely do not do that. Brakes shouldn't rattle unless they are ABS AND in "no-lock-up" mode.

[hiflyer]

Okay..that's kind of a "whoa" thing......Mine definitely do not do that. Brakes shouldn't rattle unless they are ABS AND in "no-lock-up" mode.

yep, something not right there.

[tozco]

Hey George,
Probably that heel toe brake lever you got on there making your brakes wonky.

[53driver]

Hey George,
Probably that heel toe brake lever you got on there making your brakes wonky.

Uh-oh....:stirthepot:

[shooter]

George you may have your front rotors warped slightly. Look and see if they have an uneven "scuff" pattern on them. Sometimes that will tell the story.

[Trike lady]

I really never understood this issue very well, but the damn things work and Honda has been using "linked brakes" on the Goldwings for several years with great success...I suppose some could argue that ABS are better and perhaps they are, but I have had no issues with the brakes on my F6B and it stops just fine for me......Mine is a 2013 model...
Linked brakes on Goldwings where first used on GL1200s (1984-1987).
Another piece of Goldwing history, Fuel injection appeared in 1985 on the GL1200 Limited and again in 1986 on the Aspencade SEi. Fuel injection on the Goldwing returned in 2001 on the GL1800.

[srt8-in-largo]

Your bikes don't make ANY odd noises or feels when you apply LIGHT rear brake? Mine has done this since day one.

This is odd. I don't have any wobble or pulsing under hard braking... just an odd vibration with light rear brake. I'll look at the rotors again tomorrow but I just had them off the bike last weekend for a tire change and they looked ok to me :shrug:



Hey George,
Probably that heel toe brake lever you got on there making your brakes wonky.

Ha! Noooooo... that thing is sittin in a box.

[shooter]

This is the best brakes on any motorcycle I've ever owned. Just a guesstimate but all things being equal I bet I can stop 25 to 30 percent shorter than my M109R.

[tozco]

I was just joking about the lever. Mine makes brake dragging noises most noticeable at around town speeds. Try to make some aggressive stops to see if the rotors are a bit glazed.

[Steve 0080]

Your bikes don't make ANY odd noises or feels when you apply LIGHT rear brake? Mine has done this since day one.

This is odd. I don't have any wobble or pulsing under hard braking... just an odd vibration with light rear brake. I'll look at the rotors again tomorrow but I just had them off the bike last weekend for a tire change and they looked ok to me :shrug:




Take the rotors off again and spin them one hole and put them back on see if that balances them......:stirthepot:

[valkmc]

Not sure if they are exactly the same as the Wings if they are keep an eye on your left front pads. Many riders myself included have had them wear out twice as fast as the right side pads. 17 k for me. Some owners of Wings have replaced the lefts and when they wore out a second time it was time to replace both sides. I like them for stopping but 17k seemed a little short. They are easy as pie to change I did my own front and back, super easy.

After reading this I did not make it clear that this was my experience with my 12 Wing but I will keep my eye on the fronts on my 6!

[sabre85]

The written description in post #2 is close, but not accurate. The rear pedal activates two outer pistons in the rear caliper and the center piston on both front calipers. The bake lever activates the 2 outside pistons on both front calipers. When the left front caliper is pressurized it rotates and activates the secondary master cylinder which then activates the rear center piston. There is a delay built into the system so that when stepping on the pedal the front does not activate immediately, and when using the brake lever the rears do not activate immediately. The magic happens in the proportion control valve and the delay valve. The picture in post #3 is accurate. I am fairly sure this is the fourth generation version of the Honda linked bakes.

[BIGLRY]

The written description in post #2 is close, but not accurate. The rear pedal activates two outer pistons in the rear caliper and the center piston on both front calipers. The bake lever activates the 2 outside pistons on both front calipers. When the left front caliper is pressurized it rotates and activates the secondary master cylinder which then activates the rear center piston. There is a delay built into the system so that when stepping on the pedal the front does not activate immediately, and when using the brake lever the rears do not activate immediately. The magic happens in the proportion control valve and the delay valve. The picture in post #3 is accurate. I am fairly sure this is the fourth generation version of the Honda linked bakes.
You are correct.:301:

[coyotetrev]

Had a problem with front brake locking up on me if I turned the handle bars fully to the left. . Told dealership about it before I took it in for the recall on the secondary master cyliinder replacement. After the work was completed I changed the rear and front tire on my 2013 F6B. When I put the front tire on and torqed to specs but before putting the calipers back on I spun the wheel to be sure it was running true. This is when I noticed that the right disc had run-out by a good 1/4 in. The left disc had no issue and ran true. Called dealership about problen and suggested to them that there must be a defect with the disc. There is just over 30,000 km on the bike and the disc is not worn past tolerence. The dealership called the tech line and they are still looking into whether that is covered under warranty. Apparently the tech said that he has never seen that problem before and is looking into it. I offered to take the bike up to the dealership so they could get a measurment of the run-out but was told that they had to wait for a response from the tech or they may not get paid for the work. I installed the caliper and of course the front tire has severe drag rotation caused by the warped disc.

[Retired Army]

With the development of anti lock and linked breaks how long before there will be only one control operating both breaks on motorcycles? The Motorcycle Safety Foundation teaches maximum breaking efficiency is achieved by applying both breaks to a point just below locking up.

[Davidk]

When pulling the front brake lever, is the rear brake activated at an equal or lesser level than the front? If the front lever is pulled hard at high speed, will rear end still flip up like a non-linked system?

[Steve 0080]

When pulling the front brake lever, is the rear brake activated at an equal or lesser level than the front? If the front lever is pulled hard at high speed, will rear end still flip up like a non-linked system?



Ummm,When pulling the front break lever the back brakes with a less amount of power. Not sure what you are asking about the flipping up... I have not had the back raise for any reason...This phat girl is to big for rump twerking !!!

[Davidk]

Ummm,When pulling the front break lever the back brakes with a less amount of power. Not sure what you are asking about the flipping up... I have not had the back raise for any reason...This phat girl is to big for rump twerking !!!

When just a small tike, my dad told me that if I use the only the front brakes my bicycle will flip ass over tea kettle over the front wheel. Same applies to motorcycles. My question is if I use the front brakes only, will the linked breaks prevent that?

[MisterB]

When just a small tike, my dad told me that if I use the only the front brakes my bicycle will flip ass over tea kettle over the front wheel. Same applies to motorcycles. My question is if I use the front brakes only, will the linked breaks prevent that?


The answer is in here:


"... the linked braking system providing impressive power. Pressure from its three-piston calipers is firm and steady without being grabby while providing great feel to riders at the lever. Honda's Combined Braking System, with three-piston calipers front and back, has a second master cylinder and a three-stage proportional control valve (PCV) to operate the calipers in tandem. The front runs dual floating 296mm discs, and a good squeeze on the front brake lever activates the outer two pistons of the front right-side caliper and the center piston of the front left-side caliper while the secondary master cylinder and an inline proportioning valve activate the outer two pistons of the rear caliper. The rear brake pedal operates the center piston of the rear brake caliper, the center piston of the front right-side brake caliper and the outer two pistons of the front left-side caliper. It is the kind of system where riders get a good sense of the calipers biting into the disc when they squeeze the brake lever and feel the effects of smooth, even braking. Honda accomplishes this without much dive in the fork, the 45mm cartridge unit sporting an anti-dive system while utilizing the same internals, damping and springs as the Gold Wing. ..."


Squeeze the front and you also get some rear brake, push the rear pedal and you also get some front brake. The amount of pressure changes how much.

When learning to ride on my CB350 long ago I found that the bike will fall out from underneath you when you're on gravel and hit that front brake. Even going slowly,..uphill. A relatively painless lesson that I carry with me to this day.

Personally I wish they'd made the rear brake only operate the rear brake. The linked system makes low speed maneuvering using the clutch friction zone/rear brake drag method a bit more difficult.
It's much easier on a non-linked system. With the F6B I can feel the front end diving, working against me when using it.
It's about my only complaint with Hondas, not a deal killer, wouldn't trade the B for any bike.

Did some emergency braking practice this weekend, OMG on dry asphalt this thing stops like a champ. I was expecting less but got more. I don't understand all of the physics of contact patches and all that, she didn't break free and it seems like she stopped quicker than any of my previous bikes. Is this possible?

David, feel free to use the front brake on dry roads that are free of sand and gravel and you're not on road stripes, tar snakes, or expansion joints (sheesh, did I miss anything?!). I normally activate both front and rear unless road conditions dictate otherwise. Just remember, when applying front or back singly, you're still applying a degree of the other. If you're in worst case conditions for slipping and have time to prepare for stopping just skip the brakes and coast to a stop if possible. You can use engine braking but the rear can still break free if that is applied to quickly or is trying to slow you down too quickly for the limited traction. (this would truly be a worst-case condition; ice, oil spill, etc).