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Steve 0080
07-17-2016, 04:30 PM
http://ridermagazine.com/2016/05/20/tales-from-the-dark-side-putting-car-tires-on-motorcycles/

BIGLRY
07-17-2016, 06:10 PM
I can only quoit one of the response to the article which I happen to agree with.




Norm Spafard

June 20, 2012



"Having been around the block a time or two the only part of Eric’s article that has any substance is the first paragraph, which like a few other subjects will only bring out the worst and for unfortunate reasons. Not currently a DS’r there are a few points I take issue with on a diatribe such as this.

First it is difficult to embrace such an article when it is presented so lopsidedly, opinion will never stand up to something well researched. Research in this situation requires something more than a few emails and talks with industry insiders. On example being the presentation of potential insurance issues, I made a quick call to my agent, who is with one of the nations top 3 insurance providers and he understood the issue and stated there was no weight to the potential of not being covered. Research is work and generally requires more than calls and emails. I doubt Rider does nothing less when performing road test and comparisons of equipment.

Secondly, much ado is pushed on performance, exactly what are we talking about here? Aren’t the majority of motorcycle (and cars for that matter) engineered way beyond the max performance the average or even above average rider can use? Even if the average rider had the skills to maximize a bikes performance, where could they do so, not on any of the roads you and I use day in and day out. It seems fairly simple to deduce that even a car tire can handle any performance the general motorcycle population places on the average bike

Thirdly, there was discussion regarding “handling differences”. So what does THAT mean; allow your tires to drop in pressure=handling difference; new tires vs old tires=handling difference; ape-hangers= handling difference, hard tail vs soft tail= handling difference, shoot cruisers vs sport vs touring vs standards = handling differences. You pays your money and you takes your chances.

In conclusion, Eric wraps up saying he had done ‘due diligence’, personally I believe that from the responses here we can see that is far from the truth. Honestly the only thing accomplished here was mouthing the words of marketing insiders, we live in a world consumed with litigation, I doubt you can find one manufacturer of anything that would endorse the use of their particular product for something other than what it was made for. They can’t, it would open up a court room door. The by line of the article uses the word nonconformity, maybe it is about time to look at that word as something to embrace rather than ridicule, if my memory serves that was one of the principles that made this country great. Shoot to most of the driving public motorcycle riders are nonconformists to the max, DS’ing is not for everyone, so be it but lets not throw the baby out with the bath water simply because we heard it was the thing to do. Eric is a better writer than this and I believe that Rider is a better magazine than this, next time either go the full monty and truly do due diligence or allow sleeping dog to lye."

bob109
07-17-2016, 07:16 PM
Nothing ceases to amaze me these days! I live in a world where everyone else wants to tell me how to live my life. Whether its the right to own a gun, the right for abortion, the church or religious group I belong to, the car I drive, the oil I use, the food I eat, the eateries I frequent, the food I buy, the beer, soda or other alcohol I consume, the shampoo I use etc. etc. etc. Life is about choices and at 67 years old I'm personally not about to cede my rights to anyone! Everyone has a opinion and that is great up until the point they want me to conform to their whims and wishes. Dark Siding is portrayed by the ill informed as being unsafe. It is debated to death by critics who have not a single revolution of a CT on a cycle under their a$$. I'll stop there and simply say that while all the critics continue to debate the DS Subject, I'll continue to rack up miles on my CT's and ignore baseless claims that I'll crash and burn. Upon my demise my headstone will have but the date of my arrival and the date of my departure. The only thing that matters is that little dash - between the two. It the whole of my life:shhh:

jm21ddd15
07-17-2016, 07:40 PM
Magazines only stay in business from the revenue brought in by advertisements. It only makes sense for a motorcycle mag to promote ONLY CYCLE tires in their articles. That doesn't mean they are correct on any given issue, just means they are "following their money" to keep in business. I personally ride Dark side on my 6, but cycle tires on my duel-sport.

shooter
07-17-2016, 07:57 PM
Personally , I've been reading rider magazine for about 8 months. Got the subscription for a Christmas present. It sucks. Its geared toward smaller bikes and adventure bikes and Moto Guzzi bikes. In other words everything but heavy cruisers. I have yet to find an article that related to our bike. If you own an adventure bike or sport tourer you might enjoy it. I think the writing is second rate also. Not putting down other bikes as a lot of us own 2 or more. I just don't think the magazine delivers from a riders standpoint.

MisterB
07-17-2016, 09:43 PM
Don't bother clicking, it's a reprint of a 4 year old article that was republished only to get clicks, no new info.
I understand that clicks make money, but this just seems desperate.
ugh.

Steve 0080
07-17-2016, 10:05 PM
Personally , I've been reading rider magazine for about 8 months. Got the subscription for a Christmas present. It sucks. Its geared toward smaller bikes and adventure bikes and Moto Guzzi bikes. In other words everything but heavy cruisers. I have yet to find an article that related to our bike. If you own an adventure bike or sport tourer you might enjoy it. I think the writing is second rate also. Not putting down other bikes as a lot of us own 2 or more. I just don't think the magazine delivers from a riders standpoint.

+1

BIGLRY
07-17-2016, 11:12 PM
Personally , I've been reading rider magazine for about 8 months. Got the subscription for a Christmas present. It sucks. Its geared toward smaller bikes and adventure bikes and Moto Guzzi bikes. In other words everything but heavy cruisers. I have yet to find an article that related to our bike. If you own an adventure bike or sport tourer you might enjoy it. I think the writing is second rate also. Not putting down other bikes as a lot of us own 2 or more. I just don't think the magazine delivers from a riders standpoint.
:agree:

SimonTemplar
07-18-2016, 01:36 AM
I started reading Rider back in the middle '70's. Back then it was just about the only magazine I could find that recognized the long distance and touring rider as a viable group.

I let my sub die about '85...give or take. Due to professional obligations, I never had time to read it and they were beginning to pile up. Hadn't even looked at an issue for a long time after that.

Picked up a copy here about two or three years ago. It would appear that Rider is not the magazine it once was.


....And that is a pity.





....sT

Jimmytee
07-18-2016, 05:06 AM
Personally , I've been reading rider magazine for about 8 months. Got the subscription for a Christmas present. It sucks. Its geared toward smaller bikes and adventure bikes and Moto Guzzi bikes. In other words everything but heavy cruisers. I have yet to find an article that related to our bike. If you own an adventure bike or sport tourer you might enjoy it. I think the writing is second rate also. Not putting down other bikes as a lot of us own 2 or more. I just don't think the magazine delivers from a riders standpoint.

I've had a subscription in the past and a couple years ago , I had another subscription, that has elapsed.
No the magazine isn't the same.
Not trying to defend Rider, but times are different too.
The last I knew, adventure bike sales were one of the fastest growing segments. I'm sure there is no coincidence that Rider has geared towards a growing segment. Their financials would demand it. Especially in this digital day and age where anything "print media" is on the down turn.

stroguy
07-18-2016, 06:40 AM
Personally , I've been reading rider magazine for about 8 months. Got the subscription for a Christmas present. It sucks. Its geared toward smaller bikes and adventure bikes and Moto Guzzi bikes. In other words everything but heavy cruisers. I have yet to find an article that related to our bike. If you own an adventure bike or sport tourer you might enjoy it. I think the writing is second rate also. Not putting down other bikes as a lot of us own 2 or more. I just don't think the magazine delivers from a riders standpoint.

Yep, I let my subscription expire and they keep sending me the mag. It really doesn't grab me or my want in cycling.

shooter
07-18-2016, 07:14 AM
You know guys , not really a mag out there for us. Its either Harley , adventure or Sport Tourer. I used to get Cruiser but they folded.

F6B1911
07-18-2016, 07:18 AM
You know guys , not really a mag out there for us. Its either Harley , adventure or Sport Tourer. I used to get Cruiser but they folded.

22259

shooter
07-18-2016, 09:58 AM
I'm already getting that one.

xltsport
08-24-2016, 02:29 PM
Lots of "bagger" magazines on the racks these days but we seem to be invisible to that crowd. Once in awhile we get time in stuff like wingworld. But I don't seem to fit in that demographic either.

53driver
08-24-2016, 09:16 PM
"Cycle World" created a new category for the F6B - "Heavy Cruiser."

SimonTemplar
08-25-2016, 12:53 AM
"Heavy Cruiser"


.....I like that!





....sT

lgjhn
08-25-2016, 08:24 PM
Nothing ceases to amaze me these days! I live in a world where everyone else wants to tell me how to live my life. Whether its the right to own a gun, the right for abortion, the church or religious group I belong to, the car I drive, the oil I use, the food I eat, the eateries I frequent, the food I buy, the beer, soda or other alcohol I consume, the shampoo I use etc. etc. etc. Life is about choices and at 67 years old I'm personally not about to cede my rights to anyone! Everyone has a opinion and that is great up until the point they want me to conform to their whims and wishes. Dark Siding is portrayed by the ill informed as being unsafe. It is debated to death by critics who have not a single revolution of a CT on a cycle under their a$$. I'll stop there and simply say that while all the critics continue to debate the DS Subject, I'll continue to rack up miles on my CT's and ignore baseless claims that I'll crash and burn. Upon my demise my headstone will have but the date of my arrival and the date of my departure. The only thing that matters is that little dash - between the two. It the whole of my life:shhh:

I'm right there with ya, Bob.
I'm 65 going on 66 and I ain't conformin' to anybody's whims, wishes or demands (well, except maybe for the wifey at times). They can all go piss up a stump.
I darksided 2 of my bikes with nary an issue, including the F6 today (pic below), my cc pistol is a Smith & Wesson M&P 40 converted over to fire 357 SIG (highly controversial in the gun world), I use Amsoil in every motor I own, don't drink booze, go to church, eat fried chicken, drink 20 oz. sodas sometimes and will vote for Trump. My main motorcycle magazine is: Roadrunner Motorcycle Touring & Travel....because it has great travel guides, maps and articles on some pretty nice rides, places, etc. that cater to the long-distance touring scene.
I don't give a rat's a$$ what anyone thinks of my choices...they're mine to make. I'm just enjoying every day that I have left on this side of the grass. :cheers:

bob109
08-25-2016, 08:47 PM
I'm right there with ya, Bob.
I'm 65 going on 66 and I ain't conformin' to anybody's whims, wishes or demands (well, except maybe for the wifey at times). They can all go piss up a stump.
I darksided 2 of my bikes with nary an issue, including the F6 today (pic below), my cc pistol is a Smith & Wesson M&P 40 converted over to fire 357 SIG (highly controversial in the gun world), I use Amsoil in every motor I own, don't drink booze, go to church, eat fried chicken, drink 20 oz. sodas sometimes and will vote for Trump. My main motorcycle magazine is: Roadrunner Motorcycle Touring & Travel....because it has great travel guides, maps and articles on some pretty nice rides, places, etc. that cater to the long-distance touring scene.
I don't give a rat's a$$ what anyone thinks of my choices...they're mine to make. I'm just enjoying every day that I have left on this side of the grass. :cheers:

:yes::yes::yes: Non-conformity is a product of "Wisdom"! The ability to chose and do what is right for you is a paramount feature of "freedom":039:

Ride Safe

bob109

BIGLRY
08-26-2016, 12:19 PM
:yes::yes::yes: Non-conformity is a product of "Wisdom"! The ability to chose and do what is right for you is a paramount feature of "freedom":039:

Ride Safe

bob109So true Bob as well as,

"No one saves us but ourselves. No one can and no one may. We ourselves must walk the path."


'Buddha'

bob109
08-26-2016, 12:59 PM
So true Bob as well as,

"No one saves us but ourselves. No one can and no one may. We ourselves must walk the path."


'Buddha'

:yes:

53driver
08-26-2016, 03:00 PM
So true Bob as well as,

"No one saves us but ourselves. No one can and no one may. We ourselves must walk the path."


'Buddha'

The words "BIGLRY" & "Buddha" look awfully similar, don't they? :icon_mrgreen:

BIGLRY
08-26-2016, 05:33 PM
The words "BIGLRY" & "Buddha" look awfully similar, don't they? :icon_mrgreen:
:lolup:Yea, but Buddha didn't ride a Honda.

Retired Army
08-26-2016, 05:44 PM
Now we have to ask ourselves, what would Buddha say about riding on the dark side? It would probably be something about being tired.

BIGLRY
08-26-2016, 06:25 PM
Now we have to ask ourselves, what would Buddha say about riding on the dark side? It would probably be something about being tired.
Are you ready for it?......................"Don't let your Rubber...tire."

Retired Army
08-27-2016, 12:08 PM
Are you ready for it?......................"Don't let your Rubber...tire."
Nothing worse than a hole in your rubber.

Retired Army
03-01-2017, 09:28 AM
Motorcycle accident reporting pales in comparison to that of aircraft accident reporting, possibly because the government is heavily involved in aviation. I have not seen a motorcycle accident report that attributed the cause of the accident to the use of a car tire.

willtill
03-01-2017, 10:06 AM
Motorcycle accident reporting pales in comparison to that of aircraft accident reporting, possibly because the government is heavily involved in aviation. I have not seen a motorcycle accident report that attributed the cause of the accident to the use of a car tire.

Most likely because it doesn't

choptop
03-01-2017, 05:07 PM
I was forced to leave the Darkside last year after we got to Russellville for the rally. At some point on the ride down I developed a leak and was fortunate to be able to pic up a bike tire at the Honda dealer, was much easier than trying to find a tire shop to put a car tire on a bike. I will probably go Darkside again.

tiltingf6b
03-02-2017, 09:37 AM
http://ridermagazine.com/2016/05/20/tales-from-the-dark-side-putting-car-tires-on-motorcycles/

Insurance may not cover your losses in the case of an accident
smarter people than us, the people whose livelihoods depend on their skills as engineers - do not want or recommend using CT's on Motorcycles (period and without exception)
all that said and done - it is a free country and if you want to go dark - by all means go dark - just don't ask me to pick up your health care bill.

valkmc
03-02-2017, 11:18 AM
Insurance may not cover your losses in the case of an accident
smarter people than us, the people whose livelihoods depend on their skills as engineers - do not want or recommend using CT's on Motorcycles (period and without exception)
all that said and done - it is a free country and if you want to go dark - by all means go dark - just don't ask me to pick up your health care bill.

The engineers are influenced by who pays them, they also have biases. I believe they believe what they say about the subject. I just don't care because they never provide proof to show me how the DS is unsafe.

I ran over a full size pallet that blew off a truck on the interstate at 75mph. 5k+in damages. The front MC tire went flat, the rear car tire did not. Both rims had a 5-7 inch flat spot in them. Progressive did not care about the tire. They didn't even care what I put back on it. The dealer however would only replace it with a OEM tire. After all was done I questioned the adjuster about the car tire, he stated as long as it was a DOT approved tire he could not refuse to cover the damage. He also remarked that he sees a lot of bikes with car tires and to his knowledge it has never been questioned by Progressive.

To each his own on the safety question but I would really like to find an example of a insurance company who has refused to pay bc of a car tire. If they did that to me they would be talking with my lawyer.

willtill
03-02-2017, 11:20 AM
Insurance may not cover your losses in the case of an accident
smarter people than us, the people whose livelihoods depend on their skills as engineers - do not want or recommend using CT's on Motorcycles (period and without exception)
all that said and done - it is a free country and if you want to go dark - by all means go dark - just don't ask me to pick up your health care bill.

You ride a motorcycle; which is inherently more dangerous than riding in a car. Just don't ask me to pick up your health care bill.

Just desserts - for your way of reasoning....

bob109
03-02-2017, 11:34 AM
Insurance may not cover your losses in the case of an accident
smarter people than us, the people whose livelihoods depend on their skills as engineers - do not want or recommend using CT's on Motorcycles (period and without exception)
all that said and done - it is a free country and if you want to go dark - by all means go dark - just don't ask me to pick up your health care bill.

Do YOU Smoke?

Do you "chew" tobacco products?

Do you TEXT while driving?

Do you DRINK and Drive?

Have you ever had a "DUI"?

Do you wear a helmet?

Do you eat a "healthy diet"?

Do you ever drive in excess of the speed limit?

How many "speeding tickets" have you had?

Have you ever modified a suspension on a pick-up truck/auto (jacked it up)?

Have you ever towed a trailer with a motorcycle?

Have you ever used "power tools" without wearing safety glasses?

Do you keep a "live round" in the chamber of any of your stowed firearms?

I'm really interested in just how Safety and Health Conscious you claim to be??????

53driver
03-02-2017, 11:53 AM
Do YOU Smoke?

Do you "chew" tobacco products?

Do you TEXT while driving?

Do you DRINK and Drive?

Have you ever had a "DUI"?

Do you wear a helmet?

Do you eat a "healthy diet"?

Do you ever drive in excess of the speed limit?

How many "speeding tickets" have you had?

Have you ever modified a suspension on a pick-up truck/auto (jacked it up)?

Have you ever towed a trailer with a motorcycle?

Have you ever used "power tools" without wearing safety glasses?

Do you keep a "live round" in the chamber of any of your stowed firearms?

I'm really interested in just how Safety and Health Conscious you claim to be??????

I'll bite.

No.
No.
No.
No.
No.
Yes. Always.
Yes.
yes...
0.
No.
No.
No.
No - stowed. When legally carrying? You betcha.
And? I have provisions in place where no one's tax money will ever have to pay for my decisions.

I think the main point that was trying to be made is that when you make decisions, please have the common courtesy to have proper accountability and fiscal backing for your decisions such that you are not a burden on society.
And no one person was targeted, just a general blanket statement.
Cheers,
Steve

willtill
03-02-2017, 11:58 AM
I'll bite.

No.
No.
No.
No.
No.
Yes. Always.
Yes.
yes...
0.
No.
No.
No.
No - stowed. When legally carrying? You betcha.
And? I have provisions in place where no one's tax money will ever have to pay for my decisions.

I think the main point that was trying to be made is that when you make decisions, please have the common courtesy to have proper accountability and fiscal backing for your decisions such that you are not a burden on society.
And no one person was targeted, just a general blanket statement.
Cheers,
Steve

Running a car tire on a motorcycle, does not make one a burden to society. Only a fruitcake would/could imagine that. I wish I could insert a smilie.. so the tone of my post could be humorous. Why can't the board be fixed?

53driver
03-02-2017, 12:03 PM
Running a car tire on a motorcycle, does not make one a burden to society. Only a fruitcake would/could imagine that. I wish I could insert a smilie.. :039: so the tone of my post could be humorous. Why can't the board be fixed?

Will, you and I are good - no smiley required, but I gave ya one anyway.

Only through a series of unfortunate "ifs" could a CT be made a burden to society.
And I agree, that the combination would be statistically very unlikely.

However, because I'm "ME", I would be the one to get "lucky" and get them all to lineup. :banghead:

Cheers,
Steve

DMAGOLDRDR
03-02-2017, 12:57 PM
I'll also bite.

Do YOU Smoke?............................................ ..........................................Quit 18 yrs ago

Do you "chew" tobacco products?......................................... ......................Never

Do you TEXT while driving?.......................................... ..............................Never

Do you DRINK and Drive?............................................ ................................Don't drink

Have you ever had a "DUI"?................................................. ........................Nope

Do you wear a helmet?........................................... ....................................95 % of the time

Do you eat a "healthy diet"?................................................. ........................ yes

Do you ever drive in excess of the speed limit?............................................ .....yes

How many "speeding tickets" have you had?.............................................. .......none in over 25 yrs

Have you ever modified a suspension on a pick-up truck/auto (jacked it up)?........ Yes.

Have you ever towed a trailer with a motorcycle?....................................... ......Yes

Have you ever used "power tools" without wearing safety glasses?.....................Yes

Do you keep a "live round" in the chamber of any of your stowed firearms?.......... At home No but at my shop yes


As a small business owner with employees and very good insurance coverage I'm not a burden to society, but have been used as a bad example from time to time..

bob109
03-02-2017, 05:39 PM
I'll also bite.

Do YOU Smoke?............................................ ..........................................Quit 18 yrs ago

Do you "chew" tobacco products?......................................... ......................Never

Do you TEXT while driving?.......................................... ..............................Never

Do you DRINK and Drive?............................................ ................................Don't drink

Have you ever had a "DUI"?................................................. ........................Nope

Do you wear a helmet?........................................... ....................................95 % of the time

Do you eat a "healthy diet"?................................................. ........................ yes

Do you ever drive in excess of the speed limit?............................................ .....yes

How many "speeding tickets" have you had?.............................................. .......none in over 25 yrs

Have you ever modified a suspension on a pick-up truck/auto (jacked it up)?........ Yes.

Have you ever towed a trailer with a motorcycle?....................................... ......Yes

Have you ever used "power tools" without wearing safety glasses?.....................Yes

Do you keep a "live round" in the chamber of any of your stowed firearms?.......... At home No but at my shop yes


As a small business owner with employees and very good insurance coverage I'm not a burden to society, but have been used as a bad example from time to time..

Regardless if you do or don't do something, you're a still a participating member of a "Risk Pool"! Like it or not we are all in the same boat! We all foot the bill for life calamities! You, as a "business owner", pay "Workman Compensation Insurance Premiums" which is directly related to your employees "Job Description/Occupation" If your employees work "heights" i.e Steel Worker, Painter or anyone who routinely works from ladders your premiums are based on that fact.

The Business Model for all Insurers i.e. Home, Auto, Cycle, Business, Medical/Health is plain and simple! "THE PREMIUMS OF THE MANY COVER THE LOSSES OF THE FEW" thereby assuring all Insurers a hefty profit! The Insurers rate you on your "previous claims" which they deem as "losses". No claim history and you may have a initial "lower rate" which will increase yearly based on the "pool loses". There are few of us who ever experience our Insurance Cost going down unless we have made a tradeoff for increased deductibles or ceding our "Tort Protection".

One who "assumes" he is solely paying the cost for another actions or footing the bill is "short sighted" and "mis-informed" and needs to get a "grasp on reality":>):>):>):>):>)

bob109
03-03-2017, 04:48 AM
the people whose livelihoods depend on their skills as engineers - do not want or recommend using CT's on Motorcycles (period and without exception)


Where is that clearly stated! Is that warning "clearly engraved/embossed" on Car Tire Sidewalls? I know "Recommended Max Air Pressure is and that's it!!!

"Those livelihoods depend on the skill of engineers" leaves much to interpretation! Are you referring to "automotive engineers who designed the "Ford Pinto" ( Cremation in You Car ). Maybe you are refering to the "GM Engineers" who designed the most current "Killer Ignition Switch" ( shutting off a engine at speed, locking the steering and rendering braking useless ). Maybe your referring to VW's "Trusty Engineers" who programmed computers of their "diesel engine autos" to circumvent/skew "emission data"! You appear to have a "False Sense of Trust" regarding folks having a "Sheep Skin in Engineering"! The fact of the matter is, like any other "Licensed Professional Endeavors/Fields", in reality, there are "Good", "Not So Good" and "Bad" Engineers. Don't be "fooled" otherwise!!!

willtill
03-03-2017, 06:19 AM
Trust your instincts.

tiltingf6b
03-03-2017, 08:15 AM
You ride a motorcycle; which is inherently more dangerous than riding in a car. Just don't ask me to pick up your health care bill.

Just desserts - for your way of reasoning....

risk mitigation - is about engaging in activities which (life is one of them) in a way the risks inherent to the activity are considered acceptable to all parties affected.

Everyone must decide this for themselves

willtill
03-03-2017, 09:09 AM
risk mitigation - is about engaging in activities which (life is one of them) in a way the risks inherent to the activity are considered acceptable to all parties affected.

Everyone must decide this for themselves

Without others deciding and/or determining that for them. (wink)

53driver
03-03-2017, 10:45 AM
risk mitigation - is about engaging in activities which (life is one of them) in a way the risks inherent to the activity are considered acceptable to all parties affected.

Everyone must decide this for themselves


Without others deciding and/or determining that for them. (wink)

I think that we are all in agreement that "Risk Mitigation" as it applies to life, liberty, pursuit of happiness, and motorcycle riding is personal and can only be decided by the individual.

It's when the individual makes choices that adversely affect other parties, is when conflict arises, and rightfully so.
Example: someone decides to drink and drive and kills one of my family?
Not an 'accident' - that's a mishap.
And there shall be accountability/repercussions, in and out of the legal system.

To each his own.
Ride your own ride.
etc, etc...

Cheers,
Steve