Trump & veterans

[Retired Army]

After watching Trump belittle McCain I truly fear my veterans benefits.

[53driver]

Unfortunately, McCain has "political issues" and fortunately, Trump's behavior towards him is not just President elect to a common veteran.

[opas ride]

I have the utmost respect for McCain and he has served his country well....but there comes a time in all of our lives when it is time to "step down", disappear into the sunset and enjoy what is left of your life..He needs to do this, as does the Hildabeast!!!..JMHO

[stroguy]

After watching Trump belittle McCain I truly fear my veterans benefits.

Can I get the draft of the belittling in question? I went down this road with a coworker once before if it is the same material.

[Retired Army]

The individuals that put their lives on the line to advance freedom don't deserve criticism.

[stroguy]

Well I was hoping for some specifics, but I will just as respectfully say I disagree with that as a whole.

Duke Cunningham was a big hero of mine growing up. Nobody badder than him other Chuck Yeager and Audie Murphy in my book. But Duke is not a hero today.

Please do not misunderstand that I am equating McCain to Duke, but the premise that someone is untouchable or is above reproach doesn't fly with me.

[D-Train]

Well I was hoping for some specifics, but I will just as respectfully say I disagree with that as a whole.

Duke Cunningham was a big hero of mine growing up. Nobody badder than him other Chuck Yeager and Audie Murphy in my book. But Duke is not a hero today.

Please do not misunderstand that I am equating McCain to Duke, but the premise that someone is untouchable or is above reproach doesn't fly with me.

Trump said something to the effect of "John McCain is a hero because he got captured, I like guys that didn't get captured!"

Being ex-Navy myself I used to be very pro McCain. Did you know he was on the USS Forestall when the Navy had its biggest accident ever? McCain was sitting in his jet on the flight deck when a plane across from him was being loaded with bombs. One of the bombs fell off of that plane and it launched itself across the flight deck, hitting McCains plane (he somehow survived that snafu) and sparking one of the biggest disasters in Navy history (often referred to as the USS Forest Fire) That, along him being a POW for however many years gave me huge respect for the man. But now he's on TV always being first in line to suggest bombing the shit out of another country has made me weary of his war mongering. JMHO. :icon_wink:

[stroguy]

Why don't you just find exactly what he said instead of alluding and in effecting. I'm not defending Trump one bit in this, but rather teaching that you are being programmed by out of context editorial. Trump does not consider being shot down as a heroic event, the bonehead baiting Trump said it was. So the childish back and forth began. McCain is the first to admit he wasn't a very good A4 driver and if he had worked harder he may not have been shot down. But Trump has never alluded to him being a loser, never. He actually considers what he did for his fellow prisoners a heroic event in not being let out of prison earlier because he was the son of a Senator. Charlie wanted to use McCain as a propaganda tool and he beat them at their game at the cost of his physical abailities for the rest of his life.

Now as a politician I find McCain to be a weasel. Doesn't mean I don't respect his military career. But you want to be spineless against obama, then you have to pay a political price. Sorry, facts is facts.

[D-Train]

Why don't you just find exactly what he said instead of alluding and in effecting

Here is the exact quote: “He’s not a war hero,” said Trump. “He was a war hero because he was captured. I like people who weren’t captured.”

Gee, you got me there. Guess I should get my facts straight. :icon_rolleyes:

Here's the rest of the facts in case you're interested:
http://www.politico.com/story/2015/07/trump-attacks-mccain-i-like-people-who-werent-captured-120317

[Broken Hand]

Here is the exact quote: “He’s not a war hero,” said Trump. “He was a war hero because he was captured. I like people who weren’t captured.”

Gee, you got me there. Guess I should get my facts straight. :icon_rolleyes:

Here's the rest of the facts in case you're interested:
http://www.politico.com/story/2015/07/trump-attacks-mccain-i-like-people-who-werent-captured-120317

Trump is an interesting character. He forces me to look at events or situations from a different viewpoint.

Simply on the face of it: why does being captured automatically make you a hero? Being captured only helps your enemies. Same thing with NATO. We put the bulk of $$ into that organization, while other countries skate by with little financial contribution.

Trump looks at these Free Trade deals which aren't really free, and says we need to renegotiate them. 'Experts' say 'but...but...that's how we've always done trade negotiations.'

Trump ran a very unconventional campaign. All the experts said he wasn't serious. Chris Wallace toured his campaign headquarters and there was only like 1 or 2 people working. Wallace was flabbergasted and queried Trump about it. Trump said that he didnt like to waste money. He'd hire more when he needed to.

I'm looking forward to Trump's approach. He is a character unlike any President I've seen in my lifetime. But I'll voice my concerns (for what their worth) if Trump goes back on his word (on major stuff, I don't care about minutiae).

[Navvet]

My wife and I both respect and honor Senator McCain's military career and especially the fact he survived the Hanoi Hilton.

But ......

His record as a senator has me questioning his judgement at times.

Trump is occasionally insensitive in some of his comments and I did not personally support what he said about the senator in question, but then again, sometimes political insensitivity is what is needed .....

https://youtu.be/wgSSRE27GQ0

[ReserveBum]

Here is the exact quote: “He’s not a war hero,” said Trump. “He was a war hero because he was captured. I like people who weren’t captured.”

Gee, you got me there. Guess I should get my facts straight. :icon_rolleyes:

Here's the rest of the facts in case you're interested:
http://www.politico.com/story/2015/07/trump-attacks-mccain-i-like-people-who-werent-captured-120317

I'm Trump guy but thats bs. He was shot down over N Vietnam. Didnt do a Bo Bergdahl. He was sent on the mission by the powers that be. Those same powers decided to limit our offensive capabilities so it was even more dangerous on those missions. Plus he served years in that shithole and was tortured and didnt do a Jane Fonda. Thats a hero...... leave that other shit out about his politics afterward.

[Davidk]

I can respect all people who put themselves in harm's way and still dislike their politics. One does not preclude the other.

[Retired Army]

Perhaps I should have worded my concerns in a differant manor. Will a president elect who speaks ill of veterans go after their benefits?

[ReserveBum]

Perhaps I should have worded my concerns in a differant manor. Will a president elect who speaks ill of veterans go after their benefits?
With two or three retired Generals in his cabinet.....I would think that would not happen. Plus he got a large share of the military vote. Be tough for him to kick some of the folks who voted him into office. So far it appears he is rewarding those who supported him. Hope that stays true.

[stroguy]

Perhaps I should have worded my concerns in a differant manor. Will a president elect who speaks ill of veterans go after their benefits?

I hope this helps. Trump was baited and swallowed the hook in this confrontation. But he has a proven track record of supporting veterans groups monetarily. He has been critical of the current and former administrations for the lack of improvement for the VA. He has made promises to improve veterans benefits and has always been complimentary of the military and veterans. I believe him. Don't get wrapped around the axle from this one incident.

John McCain has been in the House for 36 years and has a less than stellar record lately of votes that help fund veterans organizations. He received a grade of 20 out of 100 from DAV for his voting record on the recent 10 years. I conclude that the politician McCain should be highly criticized. Naval aviator McCain will get my salute everyday of the week and twice on Sunday.

From politifact:

CHARITY NAVIGATOR FOUR-STAR RATING

America's Vet Dogs, the Veteran K-9 corps, Inc., Smithtown, N.Y. Annual revenues: $9.1 million. Trump donation: $75,000

AMVETS, Lanham, Md. Annual revenues: $30.4 million. Trump donation: $75,000

Armed Services YMCA of the U.S., Springfield, Va.. Annual revenues: $36.4 million. Trump donation: $75,000

Disabled American Veterans Charitable Service Trust, Cold Spring, Ky. Annual revenues: $8.1 million. Trump donation: $115,000

Fisher House Foundation, Rockville, Md., Annual revenues: $55.6 million. Trump donation: $115,000

Hire Heroes USA, Alpharetta, Ga. Annual revenues: $5.4 million. Trump donation: $75,000

Homes for Our Troops, Taunton, Mass. Annual revenues: $17.7 million. Trump donation: $50,000

Hope for The Warriors, Jacksonville, N.C. Annual revenues: $6 million. Trump donation: $65,000

Navy SEAL Foundation, Virginia Beach, Va. Annual revenues: $15.4 million. Trump donation: $465,000

Navy Marine Corps Relief Society, Arlington, Va. Annual revenues: $25 million. Trump donation: $75,000

Operation Homefront, San Antonio, Texas. Annual revenues: $62.2 million. Trump donation: $65,000

The Mission Continues, St. Louis, Mo. Annual revenues: $10.8 million. Trump donation: $75,000

Vietnam Veterans Workshop, Inc. (New England Center and Home for Veterans), Boston, Mass. Annual revenues: $11 million. Trump donation: $75,000



CHARITY NAVIGATOR THREE-STAR RATING

Achilles International, New York, N.Y. Annual revenues: $3.1 million. Trump donation: $200,000

Freedom Alliance, Dulles, Va. Annual revenues: $11 million. Trump donation: $75,000

The National Military Family Association, Inc., Alexandria, Va. Annual revenues: $3.9 million. Trump donation: $75,000



ELIGIBLE FOR CHARITY NAVIGATOR RATING BUT NOT YET RATED

Bob Woodruff Family Foundation, Inc., New York, N.Y. Annual revenues: $9.2 million. Trump donation: $75,000

Central Iowa Shelter and Services, Des Moines, Iowa. Annual revenues: $1.6 million. Trump donation: $100,000

Folds of Honor Foundation, Owasso, Okla. Annual revenues: $12.3 million. Trump donation: $200,000

Veterans Airlift Command, Minneapolis, Minn. Annual revenues: $5.6 million. Trump donation: $100,000



NOT YET ELIGIBLE TO BE RATED BY CHARITY NAVIGATOR

Green Beret Foundation, San Antonio, Texas. Annual revenues: $1.9 million. Trump donation: $350,000

K-9s for Warriors, Ponte Vedra Beach, Fla. Annual revenues: $4.1 million. Trump donation: $50,000

Task Force Dagger Foundation, McKinney, Texas. Annual revenues: $1.1 million. Trump donation: $50,000



NOT REQUIRED TO FILE 990

22Kill, Dallas, Texas. Annual revenues: Not reported. Trump donation: $200,000.

American Hero Adventures, Eugene, Ore. Annual revenues: Not reported. Trump donation: $100,000

Americans for Independent Living: Cedar Falls, Iowa. Annual revenues: Not reported. Trump donation: $100,000

Honoring America's Warriors: El Reno, Okla. Annual revenues: Not reported. Trump donation: $100,000

Partners for Patriots: Sioux City, Iowa. Annual revenues: Not reported. Trump donation: $100,000

Support Siouxland Soldiers: Sioux City, Iowa. Annual revenues: $33,970. Trump donation: $100,000

Veterans in Command, Inc., Jamaica, N.Y. Annual revenues: Not reported. Trump donation: $150,000



TOO SMALL FOR CHARITY NAVIGATOR TO RATE

Connected Warriors, Inc., Boca Raton, Fla. Annual revenues: $179,401. Trump donation: $75,000

Liberty House, Manchester, N.H. Annual revenues: $276,474. Trump donation: $100,000

New England Wounded Veterans, Inc., Boston, Mass. Annual revenues: $202,289. Trump donation: $75,000

Puppy Jake Foundation: Des Moines, Iowa. Annual revenues: $289,340. Trump donation: $100,000

Racing for Heroes, Inc., Beech Creek, Pa. Annual revenues: $227,542. Trump donation: $200,000

Warriors for Freedom Foundation: Oklahoma City, Okla. Annual revenues: $459,622. Trump donation: $50,000



NOT RATED BY CHARITY NAVIGATOR DUE TO ATYPICAL BUSINESS MODEL

Intrepid Fallen Heroes Fund, New York, N.Y. Annual revenues: $10.4 million. Trump donation: $175,000



NOT ELIGIBLE FOR RATING BY CHARITY NAVIGATOR BECAUSE OF "NONTRIVIAL FUNDRAISING EXPENSES"

Marine Corps Law Enforcement Foundation, Tuckahoe, N.Y. Annual revenues: $3 million. Trump donation: $1,100,000



STATUS UNCLEAR

Foundation for American Veterans: West Bloomfield, Mich. Annual revenues: $8 million. Trump donation: $75,000

Veterans Count (Easter Seals affiliate in Kansas, Maine, New Hampshire, New York, North Carolina, Rhode Island and Vermont). Annual revenues: Not available. Trump donation: $25,000

[Retired Army]

Thank you great info, just to bring this into relativity my retirement is paying for my F6B

[sharkey]

The individuals that put their lives on the line to advance freedom don't deserve criticism.

Ever? Not a military veteran but a 21yr LE Veteran and I don't think putting your life on the line buys you a free pass from criticism, especially when it was deserved. McCain was a veteran POW and fine, kudos to him (though some would dispute the value in his service and have) BUT he is a giant tool as a career politician

[D-Train]

I can respect all people who put themselves in harm's way and still dislike their politics. One does not preclude the other.

Thank you. I earned my combat action ribbon! :icon_smflag:

[tiltingf6b]

After watching Trump belittle McCain I truly fear my veterans benefits.

this doesn't look too good - In case you missed it, here's the federal week in review:

1. Trump fires all Ambassadors and Special Envoys, ordering them out by inauguration day. No exceptions.
2. House brings back the Holman rule allowing them to reduce an individual civil service, SES positions, or political appointee's salary to $1, effectively firing them by amendment to any piece of legislation. We now know why they wanted names and positions of people in Energy and State.
3. Senate schedules 6 simultaneous hearings on cabinet nominees and triple-books those hearings with Trump's first press conference in months and an ACA budget vote, effectively preventing any concentrated coverage or protest.
4. House GOP expressly forbids the Congressional Budget Office from reporting or tracking ANY costs related to the repeal of the ACA.
5. Trump continues to throw the intelligence community under the bus to protect Putin, despite the growing mountain of evidence that the Russians deliberately interfered in our election.
6. Trump breaks a central campaign promise to make Mexico pay for the wall by asking Congress (in other words, us, the taxpayers) to pay for it.
7. Trump threatens Toyota over a new plant that was never coming to the US nor will take jobs out of the US.
8. House passes the REINS act, giving them veto power over any rules enacted by any federal agency or department--for example, FDA or EPA bans a drug or pesticide, Congress can overrule based on lobbyists not science. Don't like that endangered species designation, Congress kills it.
9. Fired top administrators of the National Nuclear Safety Agency. There are no replacements named, and they'd need Senate confirmation anyway. Those two managed our active arsenal of nuclear weapons.
each one of these was fact checked. Sigh.

[wjduke]

this doesn't look too good - In case you missed it, here's the federal week in review:

1. Trump fires all Ambassadors and Special Envoys, ordering them out by inauguration day. No exceptions.
2. House brings back the Holman rule allowing them to reduce an individual civil service, SES positions, or political appointee's salary to $1, effectively firing them by amendment to any piece of legislation. We now know why they wanted names and positions of people in Energy and State.
3. Senate schedules 6 simultaneous hearings on cabinet nominees and triple-books those hearings with Trump's first press conference in months and an ACA budget vote, effectively preventing any concentrated coverage or protest.
4. House GOP expressly forbids the Congressional Budget Office from reporting or tracking ANY costs related to the repeal of the ACA.
5. Trump continues to throw the intelligence community under the bus to protect Putin, despite the growing mountain of evidence that the Russians deliberately interfered in our election.
6. Trump breaks a central campaign promise to make Mexico pay for the wall by asking Congress (in other words, us, the taxpayers) to pay for it.
7. Trump threatens Toyota over a new plant that was never coming to the US nor will take jobs out of the US.
8. House passes the REINS act, giving them veto power over any rules enacted by any federal agency or department--for example, FDA or EPA bans a drug or pesticide, Congress can overrule based on lobbyists not science. Don't like that endangered species designation, Congress kills it.
9. Fired top administrators of the National Nuclear Safety Agency. There are no replacements named, and they'd need Senate confirmation anyway. Those two managed our active arsenal of nuclear weapons.
each one of these was fact checked. Sigh.

You lost me at #1....totally bogus headline....read about it. It's routine.

[stroguy]

Looks good to me. Better be on your A game if you want to work for this administration. Do you have any experience on what these changes will mean? No, you don't.

[Steve 0080]

For me it is a wait and see..... I am so disillusioned by the media that whatever they say I do not believe! As for as McCain or anyone else...what have you done for me lately? You are only as good as your last _________ .

Clean the swamp I believe was the battle cry. I heard the government doubled under the last administration .... We can lose a few !!!

I can not wait for the current office holder to leave...Its like a circus him leaving... Just leave and give someone else a shot...It would be impossible to do a worse job!!!

[53driver]

Thank you. I earned my combat action ribbon! :icon_smflag:

Thank you for your service!
When and where were you doing it to it?

[D-Train]

April 86, Persian Gulf. Operation Praying Mantis I believe it was called. Against Iran. You could probably Google it for details. They fired a Harpoon missile at my ship, it missed us by 100'. 😱
We proceeded to sink them. 😁

[53driver]

April 86, Persian Gulf. Operation Praying Mantis I believe it was called. Against Iran. You could probably Google it for details. They fired a Harpoon missile at my ship, it missed us by 100'. 
We proceeded to sink them. 

Go Navy! Beat Iranians!
What ship were you on?

[Navvet]

April 86, Persian Gulf. Operation Praying Mantis I believe it was called. Against Iran. You could probably Google it for details. They fired a Harpoon missile at my ship, it missed us by 100'. 
We proceeded to sink them. 

I remember Praying Mantis .... Lots of fun .... (that's sarcasm for the non military types)

I was on JTFME/MEF staff for a while in the late 80's ....

:icon_smflag: :067: :icon_smflag:



What ship were you on ???

[D-Train]

USS Wainwright, CG-28
Battle tested, battle proven! We were one of the 2 flagships in the area. I was an M-60 machine gunner that day but never got to fire my weapon. 🙁

[stroguy]

I've got this renter that has been vandalizing my house water heater. I just know it was him and I had to replace it. But when I asked him for the $452 reimbursement he wouldn't write me a check. So he just renewed his lease for 12 months and I increased his monthly rent by $37.67. Hahahahahahahaha, he's gonna pay for that water heater and doesn't even know it. And if he leaves. I can just sack the next renter.

Just because Trump will not be mailing you a Xerox copy of a cancelled check from the Bank of Mexico for a wall does not mean a physical or fiscal wall cannot be built and paid for by 'other than the taxpayers'.

Pardon me whilst I have a conversation with my libtard schizo half.

Hey STRO
Yes stroh
Did you hear the Russkies hacked the election?
What do you mean they hacked the election? Did they station Spetsnaz at polling booths with Kalashnikovs and forced voters to vote one way?
No, that's silly.
Did they hack into the voting machines and tally more votes than voters?
No you goof
Were they caught gluing chads back onto ballots?
Nope, that's goofy as well you right wing piss ant.
Well then tell me how they hacked the election.
Well, this dude named Podesty or Podestal or Podesta was baited into a phishing scam and he fell for it.
What a moron. Where does he work?
He's a big dog in the hillaree campaign.
Oh crap, so what happened?
Well the commie cruds got a hold of a bunch of email traffic that included things like cheating that Bernie dude out of a fair chance to win. Show lots of that collusion with the media to cheat during debates with other candidates. Showed just a lot of low down tactics that would favor one candidate, hillaree over Bernie.
Well, that's not hacking an election. That's called whistleblowing you dunderhead. How could you fall for such a blatant misuse of language to mislead you? Your brain must be bruised.
Whistleblowing? Oh wow, well that's a good thing. It exposed corruption.
Let me ask you this. What if your local Sheriff was up for re-election and someone leaked information that he was a child molestor and it was true. Would you be upset with the leaker or the Sheriff?
Oh wow, I see. That's intense.
Now that you are educated, go back in your hole in the back of my brain and we'll see you in 4 years.
Right on, next time I will get on the winning team. Later.
Beat it.

[stroguy]

April 86, Persian Gulf. Operation Praying Mantis I believe it was called. Against Iran. You could probably Google it for details. They fired a Harpoon missile at my ship, it missed us by 100'. 
We proceeded to sink them. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gob3lMwkjnw

[D-Train]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gob3lMwkjnw

Cool stuff, thanks for posting that stroguy! Though I was mistaken about the year. I was in from 83-89, and I remembered in was in April. 1 month before my son was born. They go on and on about how all of our weapons systems worked properly, well, except for our Phalanx/CIWS/R2D2 with a hard-on, for some reason it never activated when the Harpoon missile was inbound. Good thing we had chaff or things might have ended up differently. Our ship took the only casualty that day. A Cobra helicopter was deployed on our ship with 2 Marines onboard, it never came back. They found it on the bottom of the Gulf a couple of months later. I'm still not sure if it was shot down or if it crashed avoiding enemy fire. We can all thank Oliver North and his Iran-Contra fiasco for Iran having an American made Harpoon missile in the first place. That is one bad mamma jamma!! The only weapons we used that day were SM-2 missiles and our 5" gun. Both were very effective! :icon_smflag:

If anyone is interested, I've attached a copy of my DD-214. I only redacted my SSN.
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