New Front Tire Time

Not quite 17K miles on the OEM Stone and its days are over. Kept the tire inflated to 40PSI to avoid cupping and produce reasonable thread/tread wear and that has appeared to work reasonably well. I'll be "Double Dark Side Riding" with the installation of a new Bridgestone Battlax B-45 Rear Cycle Tire. Currently running a General G-Max on the rear and very comfortable with its handling/performance so the next step is the B-45 for the front. The tire will be mounted with rotation indicator same as the OEM Stone. Some folks use the reverse rotation mounting on Trikes. There's enough feedback from users that either rotation direction will produce good results.

Some pics of the OEM Stone in addition to the sophisticated dampening hardware of the 6's front suspension!

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"Some pics of the OEM Stone in addition to the sophisticated dampening hardware of the 6's front suspension!"

Is that a funny???? I'm thinkin the suspension ain't all that!!! The BT 45 seems to be the go to tire for flat landers as well!!!

Rumuor has it Wing Stuff will be selling the "new" Progressive front shock inserts in the next 10 days two weeks!!! These are the shocks that will lower the front end one inch as well as improve the ride and cupping as well!!!! I can't wait!!!!

Dropped by my local Bike Repair Shop (not a dealer) and had the Battlax mounted. Brought it home and did a trusty "static balance"!
With a warm afternoon I'm on my way out to "scrub in" the new tire. Have the pressure jacked to 40PSI which is the same pressure as the OEM Stone which had no evidence of cupping after 16+K miles. A few folks on the Goldwing DS Riders site have reported getting in excess of 30+K miles of service from the Ax! Time will tell!

A pic of the "new front rubber":icon_biggrin:

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:icon_cool::yes:

I like that tread pattern

Rumuor has it..... it cups if you hit the twistys to often and a little lite in the rain...after a few miles please PM me with your thoughs....I will need a front tire after Franklin!

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Originally Posted by Steve 0080

Rumuor has it..... it cups if you hit the twistys to often and a little lite in the rain...after a few miles please PM me with your thoughs....I will need a front tire after Franklin!

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Will do! Scrubbed in the tire yesterday with 50 miles of mixed riding i.e. twists and super slab! Out for more miles this afternoon. Have some blue skies and 80 degree temps that I'm going to take advantage of:icon_wink:

With 200 miles on the Battleax it is now "well scrubbed in"!

I'm experiencing a " subtle high frequency vibration" in the handle bars! Nothing major but noticeable! I suspect this is caused by the "pronounced staggered center grove" on the tire. The stock Stone center grove is tame in comparison:icon_wink:

This is not a "balance issue" as there is absolutely no "wheel/tire thumping" at high speeds i.e. 85/90 MPH.

The tire will remain in place until it's worn out! Not sure if the vibration will abate/lessen some as the tires wears.

I'll do some additional posts as the mileage increases:icon_biggrin:

Bob

Just hit the 1200 mile mark on my Battlax and the "high frequency vibration, at speed, is now gone. There is, however, a slight vibration at 25/28mph. Not a major issue but noticeable.

The Ax is 1/4" narrower than the OEM 709. It carves corners better than the 709, giving the bike a more nimble feeling. After having the bike to speeds of 100mph it is rock solid.

The performance is well enough that I just ordered another Battlax from American Motorcycle Tire for $105.89 which included free shipping. Located in Arizona AMT uses local distribution sites for tire sources. Ordering the tire yesterday it is on the UPS Truck for delivery today! That's some quick service:icon_lol: With a major tire warehouse nearby tires usually arrive within one/two days:041: Once the tire is received I'll wrap it in Saran Wrap and store it in my cool/dry/dehumidified basement. With a projected tire life of 30+K miles it will be some time before I use it:icon_lol:

In the process of replacing my Bridgestone Battlax BT45! Originally installed 16 months ago it has provided 23K miles of wear/service. There's probably another 1 to 1.5K miles of wear remaining but with my "winter migration" to Florida a mere two weeks away the time is right for replacement with another Ax. Took a few pic and will eventually share some additional photos of the severed/dissected tire casing as to show it construction and what remains of thread/tread thickness. Throughout its service life the tire provided sure footed performance and was a great "corner carver" in comparison to the OEM Stone.

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I know that the big producer such as Honda and Suzuki trial test multiple sets of tires to get the right road handling ability out of their motorcycles. The OEM tires that come on your ride are usually the best they have found to go with the suspension and handling characteristics of your motorcycle.
I for one never would change out an OEM set for a different tire. I ran Dunlops for 8 years on my 07 M109R when others changed them out and I never had the tires lose traction or do anything stupid on the various road surfaces. I ran curves hard with those tires without a whimper.
These original stone on my new bike are doing exceptionally well running curve and just overall very good road manners on every road surface I have had them on. I again see no reason to fix what isn't broken and is working correctly for the job at hand. Just my humble opinion.

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Originally Posted by seadog

I know that the big producer such as Honda and Suzuki trial test multiple sets of tires to get the right road handling ability out of their motorcycles. The OEM tires that come on your ride are usually the best they have found to go with the suspension and handling characteristics of your motorcycle.
I for one never would change out an OEM set for a different tire. I ran Dunlops for 8 years on my 07 M109R when others changed them out and I never had the tires lose traction or do anything stupid on the various road surfaces. I ran curves hard with those tires without a whimper.
These original stone on my new bike are doing exceptionally well running curve and just overall very good road manners on every road surface I have had them on. I again see no reason to fix what isn't broken and is working correctly for the job at hand. Just my humble opinion.

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With my OEM Stone delivering 16,643 miles of service and the Ax delivering 23,034 of service, the 6391 mile difference in wear solidifies my decision to deviate from the norm. Nothing ventured, nothing gained. Motorcycles, engine oils, seats, handlebar geometry, lighting are all subject for "continuous improvement". IMHO tires are no different. Like you, I had a M-109R and used several brands of tires front and back trying to improve overall mileage. A 250 Avon Venom R delivered 12.5K miles wear but was like a surf board in the rain. I like to experiment and tires are just one avenue for discovery.

Ride Safe

bob109

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Originally Posted by seadog

I know that the big producer such as Honda and Suzuki trial test multiple sets of tires to get the right road handling ability out of their motorcycles. The OEM tires that come on your ride are usually the best they have found to go with the suspension and handling characteristics of your motorcycle.
I for one never would change out an OEM set for a different tire. I ran Dunlops for 8 years on my 07 M109R when others changed them out and I never had the tires lose traction or do anything stupid on the various road surfaces. I ran curves hard with those tires without a whimper.
These original stone on my new bike are doing exceptionally well running curve and just overall very good road manners on every road surface I have had them on. I again see no reason to fix what isn't broken and is working correctly for the job at hand. Just my humble opinion.

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Agree.

A misconception with comparing worn OEM tires to another brand; is that any new tire(s) ALWAYS make the bike feel and handle better. Thus "damning" the OEM tires.

More often than not though...

...if one put on new OEM tires; the bike will feel and handle better.

I would think that the cost of tires has a lot to do with the selection by Honda when they decide which one to use on new models. I really don't think they care how long they last.. I am sure safety and handling come into play but there are many tires that will provide those. After all Honda is a large company and their bottom line is important to them and their investors!

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Originally Posted by valkmc

I would think that the cost of tires has a lot to do with the selection by Honda when they decide which one to use on new models. I really don't think they care how long they last.. I am sure safety and handling come into play but there are many tires that will provide those. After all Honda is a large company and their bottom line is important to them and their investors!

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And that there is the truth of the matter, Honda like all manufactures look at the bottom line when it come to the "consumer disposables" like tires and only spend what they have to in order to meet basic safety requirements of their vehicles. Look how many cage dealer have "take offs" setting around their dealership from buyers who want a better grade of tire on their new vehicle when they drive off the lot. The unfortunate part is MC tires are so costly in comparison to cage tires for the life span we get out of them IMHO.:icon_frown:

They definitely watch the bottom line on cost but if their motorcycles started killing people because they put 10 cent tires on it isn't really a good thing to have come to light. Bridgestones are a top of the line tire use on many high performance pieces so I don't see as where they skimped on quality here. Like I said before Suzuki put Dunlop Elite3's on their M109R's and were very reliable and very good performers, I can attest to that fact as I used to put them thru there paces on the twisty roads around me here in Michigan. The Stones are performing admirably on my new 6. I still say quality has a lot to do with their decision along with price.

Just a thought but if Honda takes a bid for a set of tires that is $50 cheaper than another and they then sell 10k units the savings is 500k. Of course they want to use safe tires but after that $ is the second consideration.

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Originally Posted by willtill

Agree.

A misconception with comparing worn OEM tires to another brand; is that any new tire(s) ALWAYS make the bike feel and handle better. Thus "damning" the OEM tires.

More often than not though...

...if one put on new OEM tires; the bike will feel and handle better.

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You are exactly right. I'm a tire dealer and thats something I've known for years. New tires make everything new , for a while.

Trying to stay on the topic of my personal experience with two different front tires used on my 6, I'm adding some side by side photos of the OEM Stone with 16,643K miles (L photo) and the Bridgestone Battlax with 23,034K miles (R photo). The OEM Stone shows more center wear than that of the Ax, which exhibits off center wear due to its duel compound construction, hard center, soft off center! There's no mistaking that the Ax is more durable by virtue of its longevity. Both tires were driven on the identical roads throughout their mileage life's and the air pressure for both tires was maintained at 40 PSI. Since day one of ownership I've routinely used compression/engine braking which would be even across both tire usage. With 39,677 miles on the clock that practice has worked well for both the front tires and my front brake pads IMHO.

The photos!

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I love facts! They tend to diminish fiction, conjecture and the guessing game! Coming from a Industrial and Quality Background I've always had a love for "Destructive/Non-Destructive Testing" and by virtue of our sport we do that every time we ride! As both a rider and motor head I really enjoy compiling actual "hands on data" and sharing it with those who have the same interest.

Ride Safe

Bob109

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Originally Posted by bob109

Trying to stay on the topic of my personal experience with two different front tires used on my 6, I'm adding some side by side photos of the OEM Stone with 16,643K miles (L photo) and the Bridgestone Battlax with 23,034K miles (R photo). The OEM Stone shows more center wear than that of the Ax, which exhibits off center wear due to its duel compound construction, hard center, soft off center! There's no mistaking that the Ax is more durable by virtue of its longevity. Both tires were driven on the identical roads throughout their mileage life's and the air pressure for both tires was maintained at 40 PSI. Since day one of ownership I've routinely used compression/engine braking which would be even across both tire usage. With 39,677 miles on the clock that practice has worked well for both the front tires and my front brake pads IMHO.

The photos!

Attachment 16870Attachment 16871

I love facts! They tend to diminish fiction, conjecture and the guessing game! Coming from a Industrial and Quality Background I've always had a love for "Destructive/Non-Destructive Testing" and by virtue of our sport we do that every time we ride! As both a rider and motor head I really enjoy compiling actual "hands on data" and sharing it with those who have the same interest.

Ride Safe

Bob109

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Wonder what that Bridgestone Battlax would've looked like if you squeezed out the additional 1.5k on it; as you had remarked in post #9 above; in this thread?

In my experience, tires start to wear very quickly as the tread approaches end of life.

I think you've done a very good comparison and I would be in agreement that the Bridgestone Battlax is of a better value; due to the positives you have put forth; and pontificated on. :icon_wink:

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Originally Posted by willtill

Wonder what that Bridgestone Battlax would've looked like if you squeezed out the additional 1.5k on it; as you had remarked in post #9 above; in this thread?

In my experience, tires start to wear very quickly as the tread approaches end of life.

I think you've done a very good comparison and I would be in agreement that the Bridgestone Battlax is of a better value; due to the positives you have put forth; and pontificated on. :icon_wink:

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Pontificated! Gee! Thanks for the flattery:039:

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Originally Posted by bob109

Pontificated! Gee! Thanks for the flattery:039:

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I meant that in a good way. :icon_lol:

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Originally Posted by bob109

In the process of replacing my Bridgestone Battlax BT45!
Originally installed 16 months ago it has provided 23K miles of wear/service.
Throughout its service life the tire provided sure footed performance and was a great "corner carver" in comparison to the OEM Stone.

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Bob109,
I had my Bridgestone Battlax BT45 installed on 10April2015 (5 months, 22 days).
This is what mine looks like after 25,276 miles. It's cupped pretty bad and can be felt while turning at walking speeds.
OEM Bridgestone 15,492 miles. Dunlop Elite 3 11,192 miles with maybe 1 to 2k left in it.

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Originally Posted by yabiah

Bob109,
I had my Bridgestone Battlax BT45 installed on 10April2015 (5 months, 22 days).
This is what mine looks like after 25,276 miles. It's cupped pretty bad and can be felt while turning at walking speeds.
OEM Bridgestone 15,492 miles. Dunlop Elite 3 11,192 miles with maybe 1 to 2k left in it.

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Tim:

Thank you for your contribution to this thread. Info like your's, IMHO, is priceless. I, like your, began to experience tire rumble in corners, at speed and when slowly backing the bike and turning the bars at the same time. I personally believe that should the Ax be used on a Trike application, one could safely get 30K miles of wear, as the tire would't be subjected to any "lean"! The Ax has provided the highest mileage of any front tire I have used on a variety of "heavy cruisers" I've owned, bar none. It's the reason I had a spare Ax on hand and no hesitation about its continued use. I personally like the "sport bike" handling in comparison to the OEM Stone. The narrower width when mounted to the rim (1/4" narrower than the OEM Stone) and the higher radius of the tread surely contributes to the improved handling/feeling.

If you could share the tire pressure you are using, that would be "icing on the cake"

Thanks again!

Ride Safe

bob109

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Originally Posted by willtill

Wonder what that Bridgestone Battlax would've looked like if you squeezed out the additional 1.5k on it; as you had remarked in post #9 above; in this thread?

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Looks like your question has been answered:icon_wink: In yabiak's post #22 he has two photos of his Ax with 25,276 miles of wear. That's 2242 miles wear beyond the 23,034 miles I received:039:

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Originally Posted by bob109

.../SNIP/...
The narrower width when mounted to the rim (1/4" narrower than the OEM Stone) and the higher radius of the tread surely contributes to the improved handling/feeling.
.../SNIP/...

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Higher profile as well? That's another positive; that will help a little with the lean angle (more clearance). :yes:

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Originally Posted by bob109

Looks like your question has been answered:icon_wink: In yabiak's post #22 he has two photos of his Ax with 25,276 miles of wear. That's 2242 miles wear beyond the 23,034 miles I received:039:

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Good stuff :yes:

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Originally Posted by bob109

Tim:
If you could share the tire pressure you are using, that would be "icing on the cake"
Thanks again!
Ride Safe,
bob109

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bob, I keep it around 39psi with Ride-On tire sealant.
I think I'll try 41psi.

Bridgestone Battlax BT45 removed after 52,069 miles.
Looks the same as it did in post #22.

Installed new Bridgestone Battlax BT45, with Ride-On tire sealant. I'll run this one at 41psi.

Went by the Honda shop and ordered the BT-45...they will put it on when they to the re-call work on Tue ...
Then stopped at Cycle Gear to buy another 8 oz bottle of Ride-on ...

Picked up my bike today and scrubbed in the tire before the rain sets in. NO B.S. from dealer with installing the AX on the front. I have a great dealer and service manager as well !!! Went for a quick spin to feel the tire. There is no need to balance the tire it is perfect as is. I will add Ride-On and set psi to 41. Will see. The stock tire I got 20K miles, the next tire a Stone 509 I think, I got 10K... will see what this one does !

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Originally Posted by Steve 0080

Picked up my bike today and scrubbed in the tire before the rain sets in. NO B.S. from dealer with installing the AX on the front. I have a great dealer and service manager as well !!! Went for a quick spin to feel the tire. There is no need to balance the tire it is perfect as is. I will add Ride-On and set psi to 41. Will see. The stock tire I got 20K miles, the next tire a Stone 509 I think, I got 10K... will see what this one does !

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Steve! Keeps us updated on you experience! The Ax, depending on road surfaces, will induce a slight handle bar vibration until the center grove edges soften/round over (first 3 hundred miles or so)! At least it did with mine! Looking forward to any and all detail you provide.

Ride Safe

bob109

Bob, it was glass smooth ! No nothing... I added the Ride-on for the sealing affect not to balance. I will post again after I have some miles on the tire. I am going to be fairly busy for the next month so the miles may take a while!

I do plan on being at the next RTE, someone wanted to check out my center stand....see you there !

Probably a mute point as I've already ordered it, however has anyone had any TPS issues with the Ride-On sealant? It specifically says not recommended for the wings...

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Originally Posted by 3Chief

Probably a mute point as I've already ordered it, however has anyone had any TPS issues with the Ride-On sealant? It specifically says not recommended for the wings...

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None that I am aware of....