F6B To The Dark Side

[Gumby]

I have found car tires get much better traction in the wet than motorcycle tires. Car tires are specifically designed for the wet. Motorcycle tires typically have shallower grooves and work for shit in the wet.

Once again it's what you think might be true vs. what is actually true.

[troypennock]

I had a Potenza on a Valkyrie Std and an Interstate and I put a Khumo on GW I had and a GW I still have. The purpose was to get better braking power when it is wet (in Houston that used to be frequently) and to avoid the 10K tire change routine. I do NOT intend to go DS on the F6B until I see it on the roads dry, wet, and with loose dirt. At least that is the plan. Then again, if I ever park next to another F6B and he is running a fatty; well, all bets are pretty much off.

[Deer Slayer]

I have run on the Dark side over 80,000 miles on Gl1800. Two Wings and now my new F6B. I am very happy. I run Bridgestone Ecopia, or how ever you spell it.. lol....Run 31 psi single rider and pull Bunkhouse camper. A big ole tire is nice for quick stops. Now have trailer hitch on F6B. Isolation box was not plug and play as there is no trunk on the F6B. Go figure? I spliced it into the wiring.

[Teach]

Mustangjake, actually no such loophole exists for insurance companies with regards to running a CT on a motorcycle. Lots of folks repeat what they heard somewhere and this is one of those claims. It would be like arguing that the insurance company could deny claims because you ran a motorcycle tire other than OEM.

Gumby, you have a great deal more contact patch with the CT on dry roads, so you would logically have more rubber on the road and therefore better traction. However that is deceptive because it doesn't account for the stickier compounds used in MC tires. I'd have to see the data before I could confirm better traction. On wet roads the MC tire is SUPERIOR for traction. Two reasons; Limited contact patch which means little chance of hydroplaning, and secondly the silicates utilized in the motorcycle compounds. WAY more sticky than anything used in a conventional car tire.
While the depth of the tire grooves plays a limited role in the dispersion of water, the compound, groove direction, and tire compound play a much greater role. I know you are just screwin with me but I'll toss out another example for you, easy visual. If tire grooves were the sole factor in traction, offroad truck tires would just be big ole knobbies, MX motorcycle tires would be the same, and all street MC tires would have groove patterns like a car.
Tell you what, you find me a single café racer willing to swap his track day tires for a CT. Now mind you those fellas are running at HUNDREDS of mph, in rain, heat, etc.... and they RELY on the tire COMPOUND for traction. BUT thanks for bringing this up because it is ANOTHER of the wives tales like the "insurance loophole" previously mentioned, that have no scientific merit.

Now if you REALLY want to know the REAL deal?? Put on your darkside setup and go run some 45mph emergency (read panic) stops in the rain. Find a straight seclude road and take someone along to mark and measure. Do the same with a MC tire. The MC tire will stop quicker without skidding than the CT (even with the link). Now I KNOW this to be true, because I've tested it myself. Cool thing about my Beemer is the rear brake is a true trail brake which allows me to test what the rear end is doing alone, and with the front. The CT will skid, read lock up, way easier and quicker than a MC tire.... and once sliding, continues to do so much further than a MC tire before coming to rest. That is the REALITY, not what one would think. This is where the MISCONCEPTIONS about what hydroplaning is, comes into play.

I've tried to share what I have tested, investigated and know from first hand use in this post. Take what you wish and discard that you won't apply. It is not my intention to argue or beat someone into submission. Nor is it my intension to convince anyone to NOT run a DS setup. Do so informed, that's all. Now I am going to walk away from this post because I cannot add anything more of value. Ride safe and I've enjoyed the discourse... T

[troypennock]

The last paragraph of the above post reminds me of something. What was the name of the IRS girl that appeared before congress and said "I did nothing wrong" and then said "I will not answer any questions". What was her name.

[mike neal]

Went with the Hankook Optimo H426 195/60-16 for the following reasons. Weight of this CT is very close to weight of MC tire which addresses some issues raised earlier. This CT has nice rounded edges and great dry and wet weather grip. Have no idea how others ride their F6B but I came off the ST1300 and ride mine like I stole it out of your garage. Put 4k miles on mine in first two weeks though the mountains of Colorado and eventually ended up in Sturgis then dropped back down into Texas. This tire is really close to overall height, sidewall height and total rollout to the OEM stones. I think the conversion for MC tire at 65mph and this CT was just under 66mph. The sidewall stress issue of the CT is a non issue for me as we raced Spec Miata cars at road courses all over the USA for years and used spec Toyo and Hankook passenger car tires for racing. 2500 pounds of race car at +100mph for 45 min per race puts these Car Tires under more sidewall stress than any
F6B could ever generate. I personally used the Hankooks until they were down to the cord and never had a blowout or any sidewall issues on the Spec Miata. My Yamaha 1300 also had the Hankook CT and delivered over 20k miles before trading it in on the ST1300 which also had the Hankook CT. The only issue we have discovered with 195/60-16 is that it really likes 44 psi to stiffen up the sidewall if you decide to take on the canyon carver 650's. Mine bagger scrapes a bit but most of that is due to hanging off the seat and really getting with the program but it sure is fun to see the young guys faces when we stop for a soda and the see the "old guy" on a bagger with a CT still having a ball. Maybe I will always be a racer at heart and the F6B has a lot of old guy racer details that make it a hoot to ride.

Stay focused on the fact that some riders will enjoy the extra milage and savings of the CT and other riders will enjoy the security of the OEM MC tire. Just one last thought....the CT will work fine on the MC rim BUT it is my opinion the MC tire will not mate up properly to the CT rim. Another thread had a great article on rim specs, contact area and angles....good reading.
Ride Safe and if you are ever in East Texas
Stop in say Hi and let me show you a nice ride down HWY225
Mike Neal

[bob109]

Thanks Mike for the informative post. I share your confidence in the ability of a CT to handle any side wall stresses generated by the F6B.
Currently have just over 3k miles on the General G-Max 195/55-R16 and those have been trouble free with great handling and ride comfort. Having ridden with several groups of riders, all are amazed at the way my 6 carves corners with the CT. A few of those riders are on the verge of taking the leap to the DS. I still stress to all those considering a CT to do their "home work" and get as much input from DS riders as they can. Teach, a very knowledgeable individual on the subject of CT's on motorcycles, provided some excellent and valued info on tire weight and the potential impact it could have on single swing arm setups like those on the F6B. Folks who know the "whole picture" can make a informed decision with excellent results

[bobbyf6b]

Followed two DS riders today on a PGR mission. One rides a Victory with a winter run flat tire and the other rides a Royal Star with just a standard tire. Both handled great as I watched them ride. It's a shame so many people are against it. Oh well, you can't please everyone!

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[kjelders]

I'll step into this discussion.

I ran a Michelin HydroEdge on my VTX 1800R and it had over 14,000 miles on the tire when I sold the bike.

Several comments I will make.
1. Hydroplaning more with a CT....Fairy tale. You can quote all the engineers, use any mathematical formulas you want. Just one of the many experiences in the rain, I ran down I40 from Nashville, TN to Memphis, TN is a downpour. As most know, I40 is nothing but "packs" of truckers which will do a number on the pavement creating those tract channels. When raining, those tracks fill with water. The HydroEdge was sticking to the pavement like glue at 70+ mph shooting a 10' rooster tail. Did I use an formula for that experience? Nope, the seat of my pants and what I was feeling and not feeling. No one knows how my bike "feels" better than I do.

2. The softer sidewall of a car tire can't take the flexing that a motorcycle tire does....Fairy tale. As someone stated before, it's not 4,000lbs flexing the sidewall of the tire. I ran the dragon tail several times with some of my TN friends and all of us on VTX's. After they tried keeping up with me on those 318 curves, 3 of them went to CT afterwards.

CT are not going to be for everyone for whatever reason. I don't push anyone to try a CT. I bought the Kumho RF for my 07 wing and I had just 7k on it when I sold the wing last week. I kept the wheel and tire. Guess what is going on my F6B when it's time for a rear tire?

Last comment: To date there has NOT been a report of a motorcycle accident that was the results of a CT on the motorcycle.

[redinoliver]

Has anyone tried a bridgestone driveguard RF?.