F6B To The Dark Side

[MichaelG]

I would strongly suggest you personally contact Daniel Meyer ( Life is a Road ). A Engineer, who has accumulated more CT motorcycle riding miles than any other person I'm aware of! I do believe you and him have a shared interest in "high frequency" riding. His miles, of course on CT's. Check him out! He's published several books on the subject

If anyone can enlighten you, I'll bet it would be it would be him!

Bob, I went to the link about Daniel Meyer, and I have to say, I was very much unimpressed with his riding history and experience. He most certainly is NOT my counterpart, as you have stated he would be. This gentle giant from Texas, as of 3 years ago, has about 1/3 the total mileage I do, and while be has shown to be a qualified "writer", that does not equate to being a qualified rider.

I think I will look elsewhere. I know of a couple riders that do ride very seriously, that do run CT's, and I will talk to them.

[Phantom]

Miles, I wish I was able to ride as many miles as you do every year.

I play the Lottery every week hoping to land my Riding Sponsorship

[Mustangjake]

Miles I know of no one with as many as you have !
I would fall asleep riding as many miles as you do .
I have no idea how you do it brother it's just awesome.
After a few hours I want to stop and get some coolaide !
I have 2 years & 6 months till I retire my wife thinks I am
Going to leave & never come back but she ain't getting off that easy.
She wants a motor home ! not me I just want to ride get the hell out of Fl.

[Hornblower]

Hey Miles--

I'm certainly not going to try to argue your point about possible weakening of the CT sidewalls over time but do you really think we load these tires enough to cause that kind of problem? I don't really know the answer but after all, we're talking about car tires built to handle who knows what kind of abuse including sliding sideways in a 4000 lb. vehicle which has to put an extreme amount of stress on the tire and we're using them on bikes and simply leaning over. You raise one of the most interesting points I've heard on this subject but my gut feeling (and that sure isn't scientific) is that a good quality, performance CT can handle anything we can throw at it. I ran a Michelin Pilot Sport CT on my Rocket III and was real happy with it but didn't put enough miles on it to observe any problems. So again, I don't know the facts about long term safety but it is something to consider.

[MichaelG]

Hey Miles--

I'm certainly not going to try to argue your point about possible weakening of the CT sidewalls over time but do you really think we load these tires enough to cause that kind of problem? I don't really know the answer but after all, we're talking about car tires built to handle who knows what kind of abuse including sliding sideways in a 4000 lb. vehicle which has to put an extreme amount of stress on the tire and we're using them on bikes and simply leaning over. You raise one of the most interesting points I've heard on this subject but my gut feeling (and that sure isn't scientific) is that a good quality, performance CT can handle anything we can throw at it. I ran a Michelin Pilot Sport CT on my Rocket III and was real happy with it but didn't put enough miles on it to observe any problems. So again, I don't know the facts about long term safety but it is something to consider.

Hornblower, you make some good points. It is not the load on the sidewalls trhat concerns me, it is the stress caused by flexing the sidewalls. And...I am not at all certain about my concerns. They are just...concerns...that I am looking for the right answers to eliminate my concerns. Everyday I get a little more willing to try a CT, and a little less skeptical, but before I put my life on the line, I would like to have more knowledge on the subject.

[MichaelG]

Miles I know of no one with as many as you have !
I would fall asleep riding as many miles as you do .
I have no idea how you do it brother it's just awesome.
After a few hours I want to stop and get some coolaide !
I have 2 years & 6 months till I retire my wife thinks I am
Going to leave & never come back but she ain't getting off that easy.
She wants a motor home ! not me I just want to ride get the hell out of Fl.

MustangJake, long distance riding is not for everyone. There are times that I really wish I could simply ride 100 miles for the day, and be satisfied. At times...it is as much a curse, as it is a blessing. But it is also very lonely. After 29 years in the IBA...quite frankl;y I am tired of the long distance miles.

[bob109]

Bob, I went to the link about Daniel Meyer, and I have to say, I was very much unimpressed with his riding history and experience. He most certainly is NOT my counterpart, as you have stated he would be. This gentle giant from Texas, as of 3 years ago, has about 1/3 the total mileage I do, and while be has shown to be a qualified "writer", that does not equate to being a qualified rider.

I think I will look elsewhere. I know of a couple riders that do ride very seriously, that do run CT's, and I will talk to them.

Miles:

With all due respect your ego is starting to surpass all common sense When I offer up a Forum which has 680+ riders who have captured and consolidated CT data, you claim it's merely their opinions Give you info on a rider who is a Engineer, Author and Pilot and has 100,000 miles of CT riding on a Valk and you infer that he's not a qualified rider Give you any number of videos on the subject of CT on cycles or CT UTQG Testing and it's dismissed as malarkey In ending I do hope that you share whoever those "very serious riders" are! I'd be personally interested in their names and the forums they contribute to. I know! I know! If you tell me their names you'll have to shoot me! I'm partial to .357 Hollow Points

Cordially

"Long In The Tooth Bob"

[MichaelG]

Miles:

With all due respect your ego is starting to surpass all common sense:"Long In The Tooth Bob"

Then it is time that I leave this thread, and seek my info on this subject matter elsewhere.

[Teach]

I've run darkside CT in the past, on my Victory Vision. I see a couple of concerns with doing so on the F6B. First off it has a single side swing-arm which means there are TWO major factors that do NOT appear to have been considered; Wheel and Tire weight which do place load on the bearings, which in turn will lead to Final Drive failure. Now please do not take this as throwing stones but you can't just order a tire online because you like the pattern, and cast wheels are heavier, which leads me to the impression that WEIGHT was not considered.
Second, you may not ride on the sidewall, BUT when you lean the bike does in fact roll up over what I refer to as the hump. That's the last inch or two of the tire tread that wraps to the sidewall. Obviously it is more noticeable on a new tire than on one that's been ridden 10k. Nobody mentioned tire pressure that I saw?? What pressure are you running??
And finally for those considering this option.... Besides the aforementioned items to consider, consider riding habits. If you ride in all weather you are going to hydroplane a CT. Contact patch is MUCH wider than a bike tire and as such will ride ON the water rather than pushing it out thru grooves. Simple physics, weight versus contact area.
So while there are some very good reasons one might want to go with a CT, mainly longer mileage, there are other things to consider than just mileage.

Bob, I'd weight both my stock wheel and rim, and the CT w/rim to see how close you are. My guess is your setup is WAY heavier than Honda's. If so I'd consider revising to get as close or lower than the stock weight. Getting a flat is scary enough, tossing the FD bearing would be terrible (and expensive). Enjoy the ride!

[bob109]

I've run darkside CT in the past, on my Victory Vision. I see a couple of concerns with doing so on the F6B. First off it has a single side swing-arm which means there are TWO major factors that do NOT appear to have been considered; Wheel and Tire weight which do place load on the bearings, which in turn will lead to Final Drive failure. Now please do not take this as throwing stones but you can't just order a tire online because you like the pattern, and cast wheels are heavier, which leads me to the impression that WEIGHT was not considered.
Second, you may not ride on the sidewall, BUT when you lean the bike does in fact roll up over what I refer to as the hump. That's the last inch or two of the tire tread that wraps to the sidewall. Obviously it is more noticeable on a new tire than on one that's been ridden 10k. Nobody mentioned tire pressure that I saw?? What pressure are you running??
And finally for those considering this option.... Besides the aforementioned items to consider, consider riding habits. If you ride in all weather you are going to hydroplane a CT. Contact patch is MUCH wider than a bike tire and as such will ride ON the water rather than pushing it out thru grooves. Simple physics, weight versus contact area.
So while there are some very good reasons one might want to go with a CT, mainly longer mileage, there are other things to consider than just mileage.

Bob, I'd weight both my stock wheel and rim, and the CT w/rim to see how close you are. My guess is your setup is WAY heavier than Honda's. If so I'd consider revising to get as close or lower than the stock weight. Getting a flat is scary enough, tossing the FD bearing would be terrible (and expensive). Enjoy the ride!

Those issues/concerns you raise have been addressed by the numerous GL 1800 Goldwing Riders whose bikes share the identical frame, tires, wheel bearings and suspension components as our F6B's and weigh 62 lbs more. To my knowledge I can't recall anyone mentioning the failure of "swing arm bearings" or "final drives". I have however seen numerous entire swing arm assemblies with OEM wheel/tire for sale on e-bay which were removed for trike installation.

Regarding the stock OEM Stone/Wheel wight that would be 34 lbs. I didn't weigh my G-MAX/OEM Wheel prior to installation so I'm relying on, "Tire Rack", info that the G-MAX weighs 18 lbs. If the OEM wheel is 16 lbs. or a tad heavier I doubt there is any concern for swing arm or final drive bearings.

I choose to run a CT not solely based on mileage. Although it's a consideration, I'm more concerned with the overall better handling, braking, smooth ride and wet traction that the CT provides. I've had the opportunity to ride on some 150 to 250 wide MT's which were better suited for surfing when it came to wet roads

When I select a CT for my bike it's after considerable research from various Dark Side Rider and Tire Manufacturer sites. I don't "shoot from the hip" when my personal safety is on the line.

Here's some pics which compare the tire contact surfaces/sipes of the OEM Stone and the G-MAX. Not splitting hairs, the Stone has 6 each major sipes for 12" while the MAX has 12 for the same 12". Side sipes for the Stone are 7 while the MAX has 11. That fact seems to contradict your statement that a CT will hydro-plane because of a wider contact patch. There are substantially more sipes on the CT to channel water which reduces the risk to hydro-plane.

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